PRP with Dr. Greco

Stem cell; cell based hair therapy
1

What’s the scoop on PRP with Dr. Greco.

My theory is that it might work for (young) people who just noticed they have an MPB baldspot/hairloss and still have velus hairs left to revive with PRP. If you are ass bald or have been for years, it will do you no good.

Is the above theory accurate or am I talking nonsense?

I know at least one guy here says he had the procedure with Dr. Greco and it did nothing. But he does not say what the situation was with his hair. If he was shiney bald with all follicles long since dead, maybe there was nothing to revive.

I’m also of the opinion that if you do have a PRP session, then you have to be on Propecia/Avodart. Otherwise any temporary self-repair of the follicle stimulated by PRP will be lost once DHT resumes its attack to destroy the follicle. Is this theory sound as well? Frankly I don’t see how anything can work long term unless DHT is inhibited.

Anyways, at $1000, is any guinea pig from here willing to have the procedure with Dr. Greco and post the honest before & after photographs (standard lighting, same camera & camera angles, same distance from camera and same hair length)? It will settle the issue conclusively. To be fair, the patient should have some existing hair (miniturizing/velus) so there’s something for PRP to revive, not a shiney bald spot.

2

Your theory makes sense save for one part. If PRP were all that then someone, no, dozens would have come forward with definitive proof. It has been around long enough to show that it is yet another unsubstantiated but powerful wallet drainer.

3

Thanks for the comment.

To be fair, Dr. Greco has put up before-after vertex pics of a guy with early stages of hairloss not on Propecia who did experience regrowth. The guy says he saw the regrowth at about the 4 month mark but it began to decline at about the 11 month mark.

That would fit nicely in with my theory of no DHT inhibition = resumption of hair follicle destruction.

Nevertheless the fact that he actually had visible documented improvement in his crown using PRP alone has got my interest. In my opinion, if combined with propecia / avodart, he would keep the hair he had rejuvinated with PRP for far longer than 11 months but that’s just my theory.

Anyone care to chime in ?

4

It might have some beneficial effect on growth, but it really is a crap shoot. This is definitely where hope comes into play.

I would have to agree with Jotronic. Anyone can create a buzz about anything, but it all comes down to proof. And the best way to provide that proof is by taking pictures. When you have plenty of pictures there is no need to create buzz.

Even as a layman when I write that in my particular case fue has caused no visible scarring I back it up with plenty of pictures. You would think that some of these clinics would hold themselves to a higher standard and do the same or better.

But sometimes we see just the opposite, with very few pictures and often times they are so vague that it is hard to even determine what it is you are looking at.

PRP might be worth a try, but it does seem that it’s most beneficial in the area of healing.

I would also add that the constant radio commercials down in Clearwater in my opinion are a giant red flag. When you have a great product or service people do not have to be blasted with in your face advertisments in order to become customers.

5

Needling, dermabrasion, laser stuff . . . any way of slightly damaging the scalp seems to be capable of spurring a little boost to the follicles. But it’s not gonna make any serious dent in our problem.

6

I’m going to email Dr. Greco over the weekend and see what he says.

I’m amazed nobody here has tried it.

7

» I’m going to email Dr. Greco over the weekend and see what he says.

He’ll reply you that PRP is damn good working (a full head of hair again) – what did you thought?

8

» He’ll reply you that PRP is damn good working (a full head of hair again)
» – what did you thought?

I won’t be asking him a dumb question like ‘is it good’.

I’ll be asking him for photographic evidence that it works. If he shows me some pics, i’d like to see whether it worked on scalp that had been bald for years or scalp which had miniturized follicles which were still alive. I’d also like to know the age of the people it worked on. I doubt a guy bald for 20 years is going to see any rising from the grave of his hair follicles.

Plus other tid bits.

9

» » He’ll reply you that PRP is damn good working (a full head of hair
» again)
» » – what did you thought?
»
» I won’t be asking him a dumb question like ‘is it good’.

Ok. The following represents the current scientifically-known REALITY:

Year : 2010
William M Parsley1, David Perez-Meza2
1 Department of Dermatology, University of Louisville Medical Center, Louisville, Kentucky, USA
2 Plastic Surgery and Hair Transplant Surgery, Mexico City, Mexico, USA

EXCERPT

Platelet-rich plasma

Wound healing occurs as a sequential cascade of overlapping processes and requires the coordinated completion of a variety of cellular activities. Each step during the process is orchestrated by varying levels of many growth factors and by differential expression of their receptors. Growth factors are the engines, or modulating factors, that drive wound healing. [21],[22],[23],[24] Beginning in the 90s, polypeptide growth factors have emerged as the “Holy Grail” in wound repair. Platelets release large amounts of platelet-derived growth factor (PDGFaa, PDGFbb and PDGFab), transforming growth factor beta (TGFβ1 and β2), epidermal growth factor (EGF) and VEGF. The circulating platelet participates in natural wound healing based on its number in circulating blood. It further enhances wound healing by virtue of its concentration as Platelet-rich plasma (PRP).

PRP is an autologous concentration of human platelets in a small volume of plasma that has a higher platelet concentration (4-7-times) above baseline. PRP is obtained from the patient’s own blood after processing in an automated centrifuge. [25] Manual centrifuges are not recommended, not only due to their potential for product contamination but also due to their decreased efficiency in platelet recovery (30-70%) as compared to automated devices. [26] In 2007, the FDA approved the use of automated centrifuges for the preparation of growth factors to be used in chronic ulcers of diabetic patients.

There are also several reports demonstrating that the content of growth factors in PRP can vary tremendously, depending on the automated system used. Variations in key properties of the PRP, including platelet concentration, type of clot activator, using or not using a clot activator, etc., may markedly influence the different biological effects.

PRP has been used in the past in plastic surgery, dental surgery, general surgery, neurosurgery, orthopedic surgery, etc. [27],[28],[29] to reduce bleeding, swelling, prevent infection and to speed up the wound-healing process. The application of PRP in surgery has produced conflicting results - positive in some publications [30],[31] and negative results in others. [32],[33] It appears that PRP probably has a greater effect in chronic wounds, compromised wounds, poor vascularized tissue or infection.

Platelet-poor plasma, which is obtained during the separation and concentration process, does not contain growth factors and can be used only as a sealant or haemostatic agent (fibrin glue).

Perez-Meza et al., in part 1 of their growth factors study, [7],[34] found that growth factors appear to play a key role in the wound-healing process and revascularization of the hair graft following HTS.

There are only two hair growth and survival studies using PRP in HTS.

In the first one, Perez-Meza et al.[6] studied, used automated centrifuges and applied PRP in the donor and recipient area, including a graft storage study. They included 10 patients for the wound-healing study and three of them for the hair-survival study. The graft-survival study areas were selected; three boxes (1 cm² each) were marked in each side of the scalp for the PRP study and the placebo control study, respectively. Twenty sites were made using a 1.3 Minde blade, 4 mm deep. Two hair FUs were placed. The grafts of the PRP group were preserved in the PRP solution (non-activated) and soaked in PRP gel 10’ (activated) before placing. At 1-year follow-up, hair counts were similar between the two groups. At the ISHRS 2005 meeting, Sydney, Australia, Perez-Meza D presented the results. [36]

In 2005, Uebel performed the second study using a manual centrifuge. He included 23 patients. Two areas (2.5 cm²) each were marked in the scalp and planted at 20 g/cm 2 . At 1-year, the area treated with PRP demonstrated a yield of 18.7 FU/cm² vs. 16.4 FU/cm² of the placebo group, an increase in follicular density of 15.1%. [37] . Further controlled studies including more patients and automated devices are needed.

So draw your own conclusions …

10

Thank you Iron man.

Those studies contain pretty useful information.

It suggests to me that PRP might be useful… just before a major hair transplant. The reason for this is that PRP would promote survival of the maximum number of transplanted follicles.

One question I have relates to shock loss of the doc running his spiked rollers up and down the head. How does he know he isn’t damaging existing hair follicles. Or maybe it doesn’t matter as they will repair themselves.

I think there’s something to this PRP but it will only be useful in the context of a hair follicle that is either velus or just transplanted. I don’t think anything will grow hair on a scalp that has been bald for years where all the follicles are dead.

11

A Canadian based doctor offering PRP procedure for hair.

Dr. Choi in Vancouver. Takes about 1 to 2 hours.

Cost of it is $600 CAD. That’s about 600 USD at current exchange rates.

http://www.mcmedgroup.com/mcprphair.html

We just need a guinea pig now to try it out and document with photographs the results taking standardized before & after pictures. Any volunteers among Canadians or Americans?

He’s got this picture up (below) of some Chinese guy and the video footage of the procedure performed on this gentlement up on his website. Its set to some classy jazz music :slight_smile:

Only thing I don’t like is that he’s dabbling in a bunch of other esthetic stuff rather than being focused on hair issues alone. But I don’t hold it against him as the info he provides on his page seems honest enough about the procedure.

12

The ‘Before’ & ‘After’ shots are in my opinion, laughable.

The pictures are different sizes, the skin colour is different and the hair colour is different - I wouldn’t naturally have thought it was even the same person - I think this is a big red flag because it is the result the doctor has chosen to show.

I don’t know if PRP works - and from those pictures - neither does anybody else.

By the way, you have two procedures to begin with, so it’s 1,200 Dollars - not 600.

13

i realised the lighting is different in both pics.

But i noticed the after picture had more lighting (lighter skin color) so wouldn’t hair loss be even MORE prominent in the after?

Second thing i noticed was slightly longer hair length in the after picture which might be contributing to the illusion of more hair. However even taking this into account, and assuming the person was not on propecia/avodart, it looks reasonably good.

Yea its 2 procedurs for him so 1200. But each procedure costs 600 as per procedure according to the website.

14

But i noticed the after picture had more lighting (lighter skin color) so wouldn’t hair loss be even MORE prominent in the after?

Freddie555, actually I think the lighting looks brighter in the Before picture - I don’t know if the lighting correlates with the skin colour in this instance.

As I said Freddie I don’t know whether this works or not, but I cannot help thinking that this is a nice easy little earner in a recession :wink:

Let’s hope it really works well and people are getting great results.

15

i agree the evidence is scant.

nevertheless as promised, he’s a message i got from dr. greco reproduced below :

You are correct that “only PRP” will work on hair that is thinning. You must understand that PRP therapy is not all the same. I like to think of PRP as RBC’s, WBC’s, Platelets, Released GF’s (growth factors) and protein. So different systems produce diferent levels of GF’s… while physicians experienced in cellular therapy can alter formulas by filtering RBC’s, WBC’s, Platelets and creating bio-scaffolds to hold the GF’s in the treatment area longer. Some can also alter protein to produce new peptides for enhanced results as well.

Three years ago I spoke in Rome and explained the importance of a matrix when utilizing GF’s and now in the last Hair meeting in Boston everyone is surprised about mixing PRP with A Cell ( an a cellular pig bladder) that produces a matrix. I prefer to use a patented protein matrix produced from your own plasma. You see there is a distinct difference and " cellular therapy" and PRP…it is not the same and is more involved.

I cannot really recommend Dr Choi only because I do not know him or what he does.I had a bad experience with one Dr who visited me from Toronto and I will not training anyone in the near future. The problem is that you get some physicians that are just interested in making money and not interested in the science.

There will be an excellent GF/Stem cells conference in Italy this month for those are really interested in cellular therapy. If I meet anyone there form Canada I will inform you. I believe there are some studies that wil be presented there regarding hair.

16

Video of the PRP procedure with Dr. Choi of Vancouver

17

BTW, Dr. Greco mentioned that he trained one doctor from Canada with his earlier PRP treatment method. But that doctor eventually abandoned PRP saying it did not work. Apparently Dr. Greco was annoyed at him at not doing it properly or giving up and tarnishing the reputation of his PRP method.

Anyone know who that Canadian doctor might be?

Is it Dr. Jones of Toronto ?

18

Damn this stupid 2 minute time out for editing messages.

I found an article on Dr. Jones website. Indeed he did offer the procedure but stopped doing so after seeing unsatisfactory results. Dr. Greco was not pleased.

Platelet Rich Plasma used for Hair Transplants

(Dr. Jones is no longer offering PRP treatments as he has not seen satisfactory results from his trial patients.)

http://www.drrobertjones.com/platelet-rich-plasma.html

19

Interview with Dr. Greco about PRP being used to treat hair loss and thinning for both men and women. Slide show about the science behind PRP therapy for hair restoration.

Platelet Rich Plasma (PRP) Hair Restoration (PART 1)

20

» Interview with Dr. Greco about PRP being used to treat hair loss and
» thinning for both men and women. Slide show about the science behind PRP
» therapy for hair restoration.
»
» ---------
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» Platelet Rich Plasma (PRP) Hair Restoration (PART 1)
»
» http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qUGSdp_nfdA

Saturday, August 29, 2009 - by Dr. Jones
PRP update

”It has now been almost 4 months since my PRP treatment and at this point I can’t say that I have seen any results. Of all the 36 patients treated, only one has shown some increase in density so far. I am not that impressed at this point with PRP treatment. Hopefully I will see more happy patients over the next few months.”

http://blog.drrobertjones.com/2009_08_01_archive.html

And until today, Dr. Jones didn’t “see” anything …

Here is another “hope-maker-video” …

BS – that’s all what I can say.

“science behind PRP” ? And where is the PRP science concerning hair loss? I think I’ve just posted “the science”.