Prediction: follica will fail

This gentleman’s resume simply speaks for itself:

Dr. Langer is a co-founder and Partner of PureTech Ventures. Dr. Langer is known for his groundbreaking discoveries in the fields of polymer chemistry, controlled drug delivery, and tissue engineering. He is one of 13 Institute Professors (the highest honor awarded to a faculty member) at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT). Dr. Langer has written over 950 articles and also has more than 600 issued or pending patents worldwide, one of which was cited as the outstanding patent in Massachusetts in 1988 and one of 20 outstanding patents in the United States. Dr. Langer has received nearly 150 major awards.

In 2007, he received the 2006 United States National Medal of Science. In 2002, he received the Charles Stark Draper Prize, considered the equivalent of the Nobel Prize for engineers and the world’s most prestigious engineering prize, from the National Academy of Engineering. He is also the only engineer to receive the Gairdner Foundation International Award; 68 recipients of this award have subsequently received a Nobel Prize. Among numerous other awards, Dr. Langer has received are the Dickson Prize for Science (2002), Heinz Award for Technology, Economy and Employment (2003), the Harvey Prize (2003), the John Fritz Award (2003) (given previously to inventors such as Thomas Edison and Orville Wright), the General Motors Kettering Prize for Cancer Research (2004), the Dan David Prize in Materials Science (2005) and the Albany Medical Center Prize in Medicine and Biomedical Research (2005), the largest prize in the U.S. for medical research. In 2006, he was inducted into the National Inventors Hall of Fame. In 1998, he received the Lemelson-MIT prize, the world’s largest prize for invention for being “one of history’s most prolific inventors in medicine.” In 1989 Dr. Langer was elected to the Institute of Medicine of the National Academy of Sciences, and in 1992 he was elected to both the National Academy of Engineering and to the National Academy of Sciences. He is one of very few people ever elected to all three United States National Academies and the youngest in history (at age 43) to ever receive this distinction.

Forbes Magazine (1999) and BioWorld (1990) have named Dr. Langer as one of the 25 most important individuals in biotechnology in the world. Discover Magazine (2002) named him as one of the 20 most important people in this area. Forbes Magazine (2002) selected Dr. Langer as one of the 15 innovators world wide who will reinvent our future. Time Magazine and CNN (2001) named Dr. Langer as one of the 100 most important people in America and one of the 18 top people in science or medicine in America. Dr. Langer has served, at various times, on 15 boards of directors and 30 Scientific Advisory Boards of such companies as Wyeth, Alkermes, Mitsubishi Pharmaceuticals, Warner-Lambert, and Momenta Pharmaceuticals. Dr. Langer has received honorary doctorates from Yale University, the ETH (Switzerland), the Technion (Israel), the Hebrew University of Jerusalem (Israel), the Universite Catholique de Louvain (Belgium), the University of Liverpool (England), the University of Nottingham (England), Albany Medical College, the Pennsylvania State University, Northwestern University and Uppsala University (Sweden). He received his Bachelor’s Degree from Cornell University in 1970 and his Sc.D. from the Massachusetts Institute of Technology in 1974, both in Chemical Engineering.

Do resume’s get much more impressive than that?

Here is Daphne Zohar’s bio…she is a BUSINESSPERSON, not a scientist, although she is obviously wanting to specialize in science-oriented-businesses:

Ms. Daphne Zohar is the Founder and Managing Partner of PureTech Ventures, a Boston-based life sciences venture firm focused on translating academic innovation into commercial success. Zohar was named one of the world’s top young innovators who will shape the future of technology by MIT’s Technology Review magazine and one of the top “40 under 40” by the Boston Business Journal. A successful entrepreneur, Zohar created PureTech and assembled a leading team to help implement her vision for the firm. She sits on the boards of Solace Pharmaceuticals (and was previously Founding CEO) Follica Inc. (where she is currently founding CEO), Enlight Biosciences , Endra, and Satori Pharmaceuticals (where she is currently CEO).

Not bad at all for a very good-looking young woman in her early thirties I think. I have a feeling she is “going places”.

» 1) Cotsarelis wouldn’t have sold the rights so early if it really had
» promise

He is Not a millionaire, to start any business especially one that requires patenting, licensing IP etc requires a lot of money. Thats why a lot of startups sell a percentage of their company in exchange for money.

» 2) the company he sold the rights to looks good on paper, but it’s really
» a kind of scam
»
scam…how come?

» 3) that lady Daphne Zohar who is in charge of the company has no real
» experience in biotech,

Her experience has nothing to do with Follica, she is oversighting the compnay. The only thing that matters is the person doing the research, and I think its safe to say that a researcher at UPenn isn’t an idiot.

» 4) you have to “wound” the scalp first… what about people who aren’t
» totally bald (NW 7) yet… wounding their scalp might destroy their
» existing hair. Not sure about this point but it is worth considering.

This has been discussed thorougly already…They only mentioned wounding the epidermal layer (stratum corenum) and you can do it at home through a chemical peel without any blood/downtime etc. And NO, it doesn’t damage existing hair. The hair’r root is in second layer - dermal layer!

» 5) Has ONLY been tested on mice/rodents so far. NO TESTING has been done
» on humans…

Well, we’ll find out in few months won’t we :slight_smile:

» 6) If you look very closely at their claims and statements, they have no
» idea whatsoever of what kind of results this thing will produce!

They haven’t given any statements about it being a magical cure either! What they have said is that it looks promising that activating body’s regeneration system seems to regrow hair and that is what they are working on. Remember its still in human trials, not being marketed yet.

» 7) It will definitely require FDA clinical trials! People who are saying
» it won’t require trials have no idea of what they’re talking about. This
» means even if it does work (to whatever degree), it will come years and
» years after HM hits the market.

Ok, so please enlighten us why do you think this will require FDA trials? they are doing microdermabrasion, lithuim etc are already available so why go through FDA trials? unless obviously, some of the trialists grow tumors then we have to.

» 8) Cotsarelis is someone who is ALWAYS working on research… this is just
» his latest little find. He is a business man, he is researching things
» and selling the rights to them right away, as he finds them, he is good at
» spin and making money off of something right away.

A lot of researchers are business men, in the sense they patent their work & license it…university professors do it all the time. Can you tell us what you mean by he is good at spin? I’d like to know more about that.

» 9) they have NO IDEA what the hell they’re gonna inject or pour on the
» wounded skin. Stimulator drugs??! Vitamins??! Rogaine??? What?!?
» Maybe they should just wound the scalp and then inject cells… but oh
» yeah, that would be HM! Whatever they do put on the skin will have to be
» reviewed by the FDA, taking years.

They are patenting all possible combinations to avoid someone pateting it later. Its not right but companies do it to safeguard fundamental reserach.

» And I repeat one last time, the biggest reason is that if he had really
» discovered something amazing he would have never sold the rights to a
» little dinky startup company like this which is run by an inexperienced (in
» biotech) woman with flimsy credentials!

» If you don’t believe me about Daphne’s credentials, LOOK AT THEM
» CAREFULLY… that’s right, I mean read them carefully, on all sources, and
» then get back to me!!!

Again, what does her credentials have to do with his research? it either grows hair or it doesn’t. PERIOD. I doubt there is anyone stupid here to believe that it regrows hair without seeing any pictures of living humans

» people fear baldbaby

I don’t :slight_smile:

Thanks baldbaby. While the rest of us have taken a cautious “wait and see” approach to the Follica concept you’ve decided to make a post full of thoughtless assumptions and chauvinistic comments.

.

» » 1) Cotsarelis wouldn’t have sold the rights so early if it really had
» » promise
»
» He is Not a millionaire, to start any business especially one that
» requires patenting, licensing IP etc requires a lot of money. Thats why a
» lot of startups sell a percentage of their company in exchange for money.

Yeah, but in this case it’s not that way at all… it’s not the START UP that’s selling a percentage of their company, it’s the DISCOVERER of the so-called cure (or almost-cure or whatever) that’s selling his ENTIRE TECHNOLOGY to a small, new start up.

You would think if Cotsie Baby really had any kind of confidence in his discovery at all, he wouldn’t sell it to a small company. How much did he license it for or sell it for, anyway? Will he get a cut of their profits, or did he pay a lump sum?

You would think if this thing were gonna be REALLY big, he’d have held out and sold the damn thing to a much bigger company, for hundreds of millions…

Not to a tiny little biotech VC company…

» Yeah, but in this case it’s not that way at all… it’s not the START UP
» that’s selling a percentage of their company, it’s the DISCOVERER of the
» so-called cure (or almost-cure or whatever) that’s selling his ENTIRE
» TECHNOLOGY to a small, new start up.

I don’t know where you read that he sold his entire technology…I’d like to see this too. From what I know he teamed up with PureTech Ventures which is like a venture firm that funds startups with good business potential. so after teaming up with PureTech he founded Follica in which he also has share (he is on board of directors), and that my friend is the way a lot of businesses start up!

» You would think if Cotsie Baby really had any kind of confidence in his
» discovery at all, he wouldn’t sell it to a small company. How much did he
» license it for or sell it for, anyway? Will he get a cut of their
» profits, or did he pay a lump sum?

Its has nothing to do with confidence, its Preliminary research. Lot of drugs/treatments that worked on mice have failed on humans, that is a not a confidence aspirer. Any sane person, let alone a biotech researcher, wouldn’t throw money out of his pocket at any unproven research. So normally people opt for the safe choice, which is to partner up with someone else (usually a venture firm). That way if there is a loss/failure, the person (researcher) doesn’t end up getting bankrupt. Another reason for that is venture firms can provide millions in cash quickly, which he single handidly would have had a hard time raising.

»
» You would think if this thing were gonna be REALLY big, he’d have held out
» and sold the damn thing to a much bigger company, for hundreds of
» millions…
» Not to a tiny little biotech VC company…

He needs money for research etc and doesn’t know if its going to work at all. Again he hasn’t made any claims yet so let be Realistic!

PREDICTION: We will be arguing about whether the Follica method will need the full decade-long FDA trials right up until the day it gets commercially released.

»
» You would think if this thing were gonna be REALLY big, he’d have held out
» and sold the damn thing to a much bigger company, for hundreds of
» millions…
»
» Not to a tiny little biotech VC company…

I appreciate your skeptacism, as it is SORLEY lacking on this board, but you obviously have less than no understanding of VC financing, nor initial VC stratagey. Why didn’t he sell it for hundreds of millions to a larger company? BECAUSE ITS NOT EVEN IN TRIALS YET. Why would a major pharma pay large sums for an unproven tech?

The steps are as follows:

  1. Researcher not already attached to a major pharma makes discovery, thinks it might solve problem X
  2. Researcher “sells” (and I use this term lightly, as by “sell”, what he most certainly did was enter a very complicated agreement that pays him for his initial IP, as well as garuntees him some percentage of any future gain. The researcher’s school also gets a cut, but that’s not relevant to this discussion) to VC, which funds trials, shops potential to the public and the pharma industry.
  3. Trials work, or they don’t. If they do, THEN the product is sold to a large company for hundreds of millions of dollars. Researcher (along with his school), through his initial contract with VC, is given some percentage of that sale, and probably also has rights to negotiate some percentage with the future owner as well.

The above was a quick and dirty generalization of how new tech is funded in the independent (non-corp) pharma world. Where did you get your MBA? What is your experience in the VC industry? In the pharma industry? You have NO IDEA what you’re talking about. That doesn’t mean Follica will work, but it does mean that a good deal of what you’re saying is very, very wrong.

I’ll say this, though: it WILL require trials, and it will take AT LEAST 2 years to determine efficacy. If it does work, its going to take an additional 2-3 years to become available. 5 years to market if it ultimately works, 2 years to determine if it works.

http://www.canada.com/windsorstar/news/story.html?id=d63521fb-35f9-4628-8ee5-ea9a45cab0da&k=41841

» Not once is there a claim of a cure, they simply say it is a
» step closer.
» To me it just looks like progression to where they are now.

Exactly. Of course every newspaper is going to report EVERY story on hairloss research as THE CURE FOR BALDNESS IS HERE! Because otherwise who gives a damn that someone made a very hairy mouse or manipulated the stem cells of a mouse to produce blah blah blah. The reporting of science by the media is always this worthless. And always will be. “Miracle cure” etc. Nowhere does Corsarelis say this “I cant predict the future but this may be helpful” No doubt the question asked him was "So is this a cure for baldness? Huh?"
You seem to know a lot about Daphne or whatever her name is and her olive oil business but you dont seem to know much about follica or what they are trying to do. Cotsarelis is mainly interested in stem cells and the ways they can be manipulated and so forth to become hair follicles or whatever. He was one of the first to propose that stem cells were located where they are in the follicle. Most of his work builds along this general theme. Sometimes you go down one alley and dont find it useful. I have no doubt that in time he or someone else will develop a new procedure that is better than the standard Follica treatment as now proposed. I am sure they will figure out a way to do without the wounding step for one thing in time. So yeah this is not THE CURE. There probably never will be THE CURE. But this may be a method to grow back a truckload of hair if that is what you are interested in.
hh

baldbaby, you rise some interesting points.
I will see if I can find more info.

Debating on Follica’s success chances now is like saying TRC will hit the market in 2008 when we were in 2007 : it means sh*t, it’s pure speculation. It’s no nothing.

:sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping:
:sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping:

thanks for the sleep.

» Debating on Follica’s success chances now is like saying TRC will hit the
» market in 2008 when we were in 2007 : it means sh*t, it’s pure speculation.
» It’s no nothing.
»
» :sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping:
» :sleeping:
» :sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping:
» :sleeping:
»
» thanks for the sleep.

Ok… Then why dont you pick the topic we debate on that deals with HAIR MULTIPLICATION & RESEARCH so we don’t bore you to death.

The Follica method seems to have a lot of good math behind it.

Right now I see only one possible unknown factor that could really let all the air out of the Follica/wounding possibilities -

If the immunosuppression is helping the hairs to continue to survive after they’re alreadly fully formed.

» The Follica method seems to have a lot of good math behind it.
»
»
»
» Right now I see only one possible unknown factor that could really let all
» the air out of the Follica/wounding possibilities -
»

yes unfortunately the unknown factor is…whether it will even ever WORK on humans

kind of important

:stuck_out_tongue: :stuck_out_tongue: :stuck_out_tongue:

» yes unfortunately the unknown factor is…whether it will
» even ever WORK on humans
»
» kind of important
»

the problem is not that it wont work on humans… it will probably work, a little bit and generate a few hairs… but never enough for a full head. not even remotely. that’s the issue - how many times are you gonna go back and have your head micro derm abraded just to get a few hairs coming out???

these people are mistaking a technique that can produce a few hairs just because it stimulates some stem cells, with a process that will really work and give u a full head of hair. far from it…

» ok I think HM will probably be the “cure”… however I am very
» disappointed by ICX’s so-called “results” and I think they are hiding the
» fact that their results have been much less than spectacular.

Intercytex has had results? Where are they? :wink:

Intercytex is a joke. I feel kind of sorry for anyone who invested money in that dud.

» WHy the f-ck did Cotsie baby sell this shyte so fast to Follica/Pure
» Tech???

It isn’t uncommon for early stage start-ups to bring in outside investors to fund research before they have an actual product.

» Headed by some chick who has a Bachelors of something (marketing?) from
» Northeastern U. in Boston (not exactly an Ivy League school… far from
» it!) who milked her Daddy’s medical and biotech connections from Mass
» General Hospital, to keep on starting start ups for weird shyte like olive
» oil and horse running shoes?

The Ivy League is a joke. Try reading up on grade inflation at Yale or Harvard sometime.

But, yeah, if that stuff about running shoes for horses and olive oil are true, that isn’t a very credible outfit. In fact, it sounds downright kooky! :smiley:

» » yes unfortunately the unknown factor is…whether it
» will
» » even ever WORK on humans
» »
» » kind of important
» »
»
» the problem is not that it wont work on humans… it will probably work, a
» little bit and generate a few hairs… but never enough for a full head.
» not even remotely. that’s the issue - how many times are you gonna go
» back and have your head micro derm abraded just to get a few hairs coming
» out???
»
» these people are mistaking a technique that can produce a few hairs just
» because it stimulates some stem cells, with a process that will really work
» and give u a full head of hair. far from it…

How do you know for a fact what results they are going to get?

you always point out what is important information

keep it up !

» » yes unfortunately the unknown factor is…whether it
» will
» » even ever WORK on humans
» »
» » kind of important
» »
»
» the problem is not that it wont work on humans… it will probably work, a
» little bit and generate a few hairs… but never enough for a full head.
» not even remotely. that’s the issue - how many times are you gonna go
» back and have your head micro derm abraded just to get a few hairs coming
» out???
»
» these people are mistaking a technique that can produce a few hairs just
» because it stimulates some stem cells, with a process that will really work
» and give u a full head of hair. far from it…

nobody knows untilt they trial it in humans—including you
thats why some of us 9like me9 want them to go ahead and try it in people asap and see what those same people have three or four months down the line…its the only way to know for sure…if follica doesn’t work, the hm forum will be about useless for another two or three years because of phase three being required for hm…for anything near term 9less than five years9 …its follica or nothing