More Work = More Shockloss?

Hair Transplant
1

Just trying to see what peoples thoughts are here?

I have a virgin scalp, and I am planning on getting FUE grafts over a period of years. I would like to start out with 1,000 FUE grafts to my crown early next spring. And then get about 1,000-2,000 grafts every few years for touch up.

My question is, would I be better off doing many little operations or a few big ones due to shockloss.

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

2

Hi missmyhair,

IMO, shockloss is “over feared” on the HT forums, in general.

I’ve had 18 procedures with three different docs since 1992 with no noticeable shockloss whatsoever.
16 strips, 2 BHT.

Does it happen?
Yes.

Could be the technique of the doc?
The anesthesia?
Individual healing characteristics?

I’ll tell you…
I don’t know.

However, I’ve only read of a small group of patients who have documented their shockloss.
It seems to almost always grow back over time anyway.

IMO, FUE over time (if you aren’t looking for a major transformation “overnight”) is the way to go.
To me, it makes sense to “keep up with your hairloss” this way.

I did that with strips.
Very risky.
This isn’t even attempted today (16 strips, once every year or more dating back to 1992).

But with FUE (well executed) folks really could “pay as you go”, if you will.

That’s what I’d do if I were starting out again.

Please remember, I’m speaking in generalities and I’m only a patient.

Can you post some pics?
It’s hard to give you specific advise about your case without good pix.

Peace.

3

Hello Sofarsogood,

Thanks for the response. I will post pictures for you sometime this weekend when I get a chance. I am a NW4 I would say and almost 28, been losing my hair since 18.

Damn! You had 16 strip procedures? Sorry, I don’t mean to make you feel bad. I’m just amazed that you’ve had this many procedures. You must have a lot of scarring. Wow, so shaving your head definately is not an option huh? Do you have good coverage though now as a result of all of your procedures? Do you have pics up?

Thanks for your input on the shockloss.

» Hi missmyhair,
»
» IMO, shockloss is “over feared” on the HT forums, in general.
»
» I’ve had 18 procedures with three different docs since 1992 with no
» noticeable shockloss whatsoever.
» 16 strips, 2 BHT.
»
» Does it happen?
» Yes.
»
» Could be the technique of the doc?
» The anesthesia?
» Individual healing characteristics?
»
» I’ll tell you…
» I don’t know.
»
» However, I’ve only read of a small group of patients who have documented
» their shockloss.
» It seems to almost always grow back over time anyway.
»
» IMO, FUE over time (if you aren’t looking for a major transformation
» “overnight”) is the way to go.
» To me, it makes sense to “keep up with your hairloss” this way.
»
» I did that with strips.
» Very risky.
» This isn’t even attempted today (16 strips, once every year or more dating
» back to 1992).
»
» But with FUE (well executed) folks really could “pay as you go”, if you
» will.
»
» That’s what I’d do if I were starting out again.
»
» Please remember, I’m speaking in generalities and I’m only a patient.
»
» Can you post some pics?
» It’s hard to give you specific advise about your case without good pix.
»
» Peace.

4

Shockloss is very unpredictable. But is does not happen to all. One thing no know is there was a recent case of shockloss in the donor area where FUE was performed. He posted the pictures here too. That was the first time in 5 years that I had ever seen it happen in the donor area… but the reality of it is that it can happen their too.

The good news is that most FUE clinics are adhering to the use of smaller punches. This reduces the peripheral transection potential and keeps the “white dotting” potential low too. Research the doctors/clinics you are thinking of using. If you see any red flags… just go ahead and stay away from those clinics. Your head and money is not worth having to wonder about clinic reputation.

5

» Shockloss is very unpredictable. But is does not happen to all. One thing
» no know is there was a recent case of shockloss in the donor area where FUE
» was performed. He posted the pictures here too. That was the first time in
» 5 years that I had ever seen it happen in the donor area… but the reality
» of it is that it can happen their too.
»
» The good news is that most FUE clinics are adhering to the use of smaller
» punches. This reduces the peripheral transection potential and keeps the
» “white dotting” potential low too. Research the doctors/clinics you are
» thinking of using. If you see any red flags… just go ahead and stay
» away from those clinics. Your head and money is not worth having to
» wonder about clinic reputation.

Its definitley going to be easier to pay for if you do it pay as you go style. Some say that the yeild is better in smaller FUE sessions but were seeing more and more FUE megasessions that disprove this theory. Its up to you.

6

Nobody knows for sure. But for me personally, I prefer smaller sessions. I do believe the smaller sessions = less trauma = less anesthetics required = less chance of shock loss.

7

missmyhair,

Just click the link in my signature for pix.

Ciao and good luck.

8

I personally don’t recommend small sessions of 1000 grafts or so… (depending on your hairloss situation)

realistically 1000 grafts doesn’t do much at all… its about enough to get the taste in your mouth and see whats possible.

the problem with that is, although FUE is much less invasive, its still a surgery.

you’re going to be put on drugs so you don’t feel the pain, you’re going to have to shave your head, you’ll probably have to wear a hat for a month while it heals, your donor area is going to have to heal.

the smaller sessions you do, the more you’re going to have to do this… this is valuable living time right here.

i get seriously depressed for 2 months following the surgery while my scalp goes back to normal; and then i sit aorund and wait for it to grow in for another month… thats 3 months out of my year right there…

so for me I would make it worth it and go at least 3k;
thats when you start noticing the 'transformations; happen.

that’s my opinion though.
I’ve had 2 procedures in the past 2 years (3800 FUE+BHT; 3200 FUE BHT) into diffuse thinning mind you.
and probably another 3k in the next year or so.

good luck

» Just trying to see what peoples thoughts are here?
»
» I have a virgin scalp, and I am planning on getting FUE grafts over a
» period of years. I would like to start out with 1,000 FUE grafts to my
» crown early next spring. And then get about 1,000-2,000 grafts every few
» years for touch up.
»
» My question is, would I be better off doing many little operations or a
» few big ones due to shockloss.
»
» Any feedback would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

9

Thanks for your insight Schmoe. Do you have any pics of yourself pre and post both sessions? I’d like to see them. Maybe I’ll consider 2K, I’m just not ready to take a big plunge yet as far as doing any work mostly b/c of finacial reasons. But I’m getting to the point where I really want to do something about my hairloss even if it isn’t something huge. So 2K might be a better option. I really just want to touch up my crown first, and then take it from there.

Thanks,

Chris

» I personally don’t recommend small sessions of 1000 grafts or so…
» (depending on your hairloss situation)
»
» realistically 1000 grafts doesn’t do much at all… its about enough to get
» the taste in your mouth and see whats possible.
»
» the problem with that is, although FUE is much less invasive, its still a
» surgery.
»
» you’re going to be put on drugs so you don’t feel the pain, you’re going
» to have to shave your head, you’ll probably have to wear a hat for a month
» while it heals, your donor area is going to have to heal.
»
» the smaller sessions you do, the more you’re going to have to do this…
» this is valuable living time right here.
»
» i get seriously depressed for 2 months following the surgery while my
» scalp goes back to normal; and then i sit aorund and wait for it to grow
» in for another month… thats 3 months out of my year right there…
»
» so for me I would make it worth it and go at least 3k;
» thats when you start noticing the 'transformations; happen.
»
» that’s my opinion though.
» I’ve had 2 procedures in the past 2 years (3800 FUE+BHT; 3200 FUE BHT)
» into diffuse thinning mind you.
» and probably another 3k in the next year or so.
»
» good luck
»
» » Just trying to see what peoples thoughts are here?
» »
» » I have a virgin scalp, and I am planning on getting FUE grafts over a
» » period of years. I would like to start out with 1,000 FUE grafts to my
» » crown early next spring. And then get about 1,000-2,000 grafts every
» few
» » years for touch up.
» »
» » My question is, would I be better off doing many little operations or a
» » few big ones due to shockloss.
» »
» » Any feedback would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

10

» missmyhair,
»
» Just click the link in my signature for pix.
»
» Ciao and good luck.

Wow sofarsogood,

Your hair looks amazing! Congrats! I wish my hair looked have as good as that. I will get some pics up shortly, sorry. What NW were you when you first started down this trail?

Thanks.

11

Hi Schmoe,
Any chance of an update?
How is the BHT? Was it worth it?
Did the second round make a bigger impact?
Are you happy with the Dr. A experience so far?

Hope all is well!

Cheers,
Marco.

12

Missmyhair,
Pics would be very helpful to see what your situation is. The number you need to make a cosmetic difference depends totally on the surface area that you need covered. I personally think its best to try and do as much as you can at once as schmoe stated unless you are wanting to do a small test session to simply test growth rates etc. The financial situation is something we all understand .

19,000 grafts by Dr Umar
www.myhairtransformation.com

13

Dear missmyhair,

Your post reminds me of a patient with whom I had a detailed discussion some time back.

Personally, I prefer to value the patient’s preference as much as the doctor’s opinion.

That is, if the patient is fully aware of what he is getting into.

Going for a small session in the crown means you may have to go for repeated sessions, as and when you lose more hair. Have you thought about that?

Can you post/email some pictures?

If you do decide to go for crown area transplant, it may be good to think of restricting it to the front of the swirl. That still gives you more leeway.

Also, what is your body and facial hair like?
These are valuable additional donor hair that can help you tide over donor shortage (if you have them).

Regards,
Dr. A

14

Hello Dr Arvind,

Let me say that I have been impressed with your work before I say anything. Here are my pics, I forgot that I sent them to David earlier this year. Some thing have changed since then, as far as what I am thinking. I can get some other pics up tonight too after I workout. I know these are pretty blurry. Please follow this link. Thanks. I gotta run but will get back to you guys tonight.

http://hairsite.com/serendipity/authors/131-Missmyhair

» Dear missmyhair,
»
» Your post reminds me of a patient with whom I had a detailed discussion
» some time back.
» Centre For Hair Restoration: Crown v/s Frontal HT - alternate approaches
»
» Personally, I prefer to value the patient’s preference as much as the
» doctor’s opinion.
»
» That is, if the patient is fully aware of what he is getting into.
»
»
» Going for a small session in the crown means you may have to go for
» repeated sessions, as and when you lose more hair. Have you thought about
» that?
»
» Can you post/email some pictures?
»
» If you do decide to go for crown area transplant, it may be good to think
» of restricting it to the front of the swirl. That still gives you more
» leeway.
»
» Also, what is your body and facial hair like?
» These are valuable additional donor hair that can help you tide over donor
» shortage (if you have them).
»
» Regards,
» Dr. A

15

Thanks for your input Heliboy. How’s life treating you these days? Your result is fantastic. One of the best I’ve seen considering going where you were at pre-op w/ Dr. Umar. I’ve got some pics in this link that are somewhat blurry. I’m gonna get some better ones up tonight after I hit up the gym.

I guess the main reason I don’t want to do a lot in one session is because of the price. But I’ve been thinking more and more about it. Some people take out big loans to buy a nice car, I would be doing essentailly the same, and more from a personal confidence and happiness standpoint.

Anyway, thanks for your input. Your opinon is greatly appreciated. And it is nice to see guys like you, wassup, and bobman coming back here to post and interact with many of us who are where many of you once were.

Chris

» Missmyhair,
» Pics would be very helpful to see what your situation is. The number you
» need to make a cosmetic difference depends totally on the surface area
» that you need covered. I personally think its best to try and do as much
» as you can at once as schmoe stated unless you are wanting to do a small
» test session to simply test growth rates etc. The financial situation is
» something we all understand .
»
» 19,000 grafts by Dr Umar
» www.myhairtransformation.com

16

Sorry,

Here’s the link:

http://hairsite.com/serendipity/authors/131-Missmyhair

» Thanks for your input Heliboy. How’s life treating you these days? Your
» result is fantastic. One of the best I’ve seen considering going where
» you were at pre-op w/ Dr. Umar. I’ve got some pics in this link that are
» somewhat blurry. I’m gonna get some better ones up tonight after I hit up
» the gym.
»
» I guess the main reason I don’t want to do a lot in one session is because
» of the price. But I’ve been thinking more and more about it. Some people
» take out big loans to buy a nice car, I would be doing essentailly the
» same, and more from a personal confidence and happiness standpoint.
»
» Anyway, thanks for your input. Your opinon is greatly appreciated. And
» it is nice to see guys like you, wassup, and bobman coming back here to
» post and interact with many of us who are where many of you once were.
»
» Chris
»
» » Missmyhair,
» » Pics would be very helpful to see what your situation is. The number
» you
» » need to make a cosmetic difference depends totally on the surface area
» » that you need covered. I personally think its best to try and do as
» much
» » as you can at once as schmoe stated unless you are wanting to do a
» small
» » test session to simply test growth rates etc. The financial situation
» is
» » something we all understand .
» »
» » 19,000 grafts by Dr Umar
» » www.myhairtransformation.com

17




Here you go guys. I’m not really worried about shaving my head or during this process as I wear my hair very short anyway. Also I want to fix my crown before doing a lot of work to my hair line. Like to know what you guys think. I consider myself a NW-4 but maybe some here would say NW-3 or NW-5. Thanks.

» Hello Dr Arvind,
»
» Let me say that I have been impressed with your work before I say
» anything. Here are my pics, I forgot that I sent them to David earlier
» this year. Some thing have changed since then, as far as what I am
» thinking. I can get some other pics up tonight too after I workout. I
» know these are pretty blurry. Please follow this link. Thanks. I gotta
» run but will get back to you guys tonight.
»
» http://hairsite.com/serendipity/authors/131-Missmyhair
»
»
»
» » Dear missmyhair,
» »
» » Your post reminds me of a patient with whom I had a detailed discussion
» » some time back.
» »
» Centre For Hair Restoration: Crown v/s Frontal HT - alternate approaches
» »
» » Personally, I prefer to value the patient’s preference as much as the
» » doctor’s opinion.
» »
» » That is, if the patient is fully aware of what he is getting into.
» »
» »
» » Going for a small session in the crown means you may have to go for
» » repeated sessions, as and when you lose more hair. Have you thought
» about
» » that?
» »
» » Can you post/email some pictures?
» »
» » If you do decide to go for crown area transplant, it may be good to
» think
» » of restricting it to the front of the swirl. That still gives you more
» » leeway.
» »
» » Also, what is your body and facial hair like?
» » These are valuable additional donor hair that can help you tide over
» donor
» » shortage (if you have them).
» »
» » Regards,
» » Dr. A

18

Missmyhair,
I’m doing great and glad to be moving on now. Its good to see that you havent made any poor decisions in the past and seeking repair.

When I speak of numbers I speak in terms of amounts taken via FUE. To me that is the preferred extraction method but there are others here who have had good strip experiences and I would have to let them address that option. Based on your crown you appear to need approx. 3000 grafts into your crown area. Your frontal area totally depends on how agressive you want your hairline in terms of temporal work and whether you want a ‘closed temple’ or an ‘open’ recessed appearance. Everyone has differing expectations based on the facial structure. I personally think a closed temple look depicts a more youthful appearance and frames the face better verus an open ‘recessed’ look. Again everyone has their opinions on this one. I think you should look at 3000-4000 grafts in your frontal area to recreate the hairline /temples .

In terms of financing I have used your example of car financing many times on the forum. I have financed my transplant work and spread it out over years to make it affordable for me on a monthly basis .The key to any financing situation is finding affordable interest rates which involved doing some research . It all comes down to how much hair loss affects you .

I think you are looking at 6000 - 7000 grafts to provide coverage in both areas (front and back) . This is only my opinion . You have good quality hair to work with . Your midscalp area that currently has good hair now would likely need addressing in the future so this is something that you should ask about when you are discussing with an M.D . Good luck!!

19,000 grafts by Dr Umar
www.myhairtransformation.com

19

Helioboy,

Thanks again for your input. I am thinking of just doing the crown first. Although I would truelly like to restore the hairline too, I’m just not ready to do that financially yet. I think crown work only at this point would be realistic for me, and then hopefully in few more years some light touch up on the crown again, and then the majority going to rebuild the hairline.

I plan on financing for a number of years, and understand that is not a race, not a sprint as I will be losing more hair along the way. But also I hope to be making substancially more $$$ money in the next 5-7 years. I’m looking at doing my Masters next fall if all goes right.

I would definately prefer a closed look for hairline, but I think based on my long narrow face, and the fact that I will be losing more hair, and that I have been losing hair, doing an open will be better for me. I think that would look more natural on my face.

Yeah that is true about how much hairloss affects someone. It has really taken a hard grip on my life. Which is pretty sad. And it’s stopped me from going after and doing some things I would have otherwise not thought twice about. It is definately not an enjoyable experience, but I think I am a better person in some ways b/c of having to deal with it. I am definately more empathetic to other people’s situations then I was when I was younger, but then agian I was in my teens back then. Anyway, it really affects me a great deal, and I feel I have a great opportunity to do something about it, so I am doing it. This is all very recent really. I mean men have been feeling like shit as a result of their hair loss for centuries. We are so lucky to live in a time where we can litterly reverse mother nature. And Helioboy you are living prood and definately an inspiration to many.

I’ve thought a lot about what hair is currently there too, and knowing that someday I would have to replace that too. This is really just a band aid, and that I will have to get many more band-aids until all is back to normal.

Thanks

» Missmyhair,
» I’m doing great and glad to be moving on now. Its good to see that you
» havent made any poor decisions in the past and seeking repair.
»
» When I speak of numbers I speak in terms of amounts taken via FUE. To me
» that is the preferred extraction method but there are others here who have
» had good strip experiences and I would have to let them address that
» option. Based on your crown you appear to need approx. 3000 grafts into
» your crown area. Your frontal area totally depends on how agressive you
» want your hairline in terms of temporal work and whether you want a
» ‘closed temple’ or an ‘open’ recessed appearance. Everyone has differing
» expectations based on the facial structure. I personally think a closed
» temple look depicts a more youthful appearance and frames the face better
» verus an open ‘recessed’ look. Again everyone has their opinions on this
» one. I think you should look at 3000-4000 grafts in your frontal area to
» recreate the hairline /temples .
»
» In terms of financing I have used your example of car financing many times
» on the forum. I have financed my transplant work and spread it out over
» years to make it affordable for me on a monthly basis .The key to any
» financing situation is finding affordable interest rates which involved
» doing some research . It all comes down to how much hair loss affects you
» .
»
»
» I think you are looking at 6000 - 7000 grafts to provide coverage in both
» areas (front and back) . This is only my opinion . You have good quality
» hair to work with . Your midscalp area that currently has good hair now
» would likely need addressing in the future so this is something that you
» should ask about when you are discussing with an M.D . Good luck!!
»
» 19,000 grafts by Dr Umar
» www.myhairtransformation.com

20

Oh yeah,

I re-sent my online consult for your Doc, Dr. Umar again tonight. I sent it back in April, but now I am getting serious to really go thru with this and Dr. Umar is definately on my list.

» Helioboy,
»
» Thanks again for your input. I am thinking of just doing the crown first.
» Although I would truelly like to restore the hairline too, I’m just not
» ready to do that financially yet. I think crown work only at this point
» would be realistic for me, and then hopefully in few more years some light
» touch up on the crown again, and then the majority going to rebuild the
» hairline.
»
» I plan on financing for a number of years, and understand that is not a
» race, not a sprint as I will be losing more hair along the way. But also
» I hope to be making substancially more $$$ money in the next 5-7 years.
» I’m looking at doing my Masters next fall if all goes right.
»
» I would definately prefer a closed look for hairline, but I think based on
» my long narrow face, and the fact that I will be losing more hair, and that
» I have been losing hair, doing an open will be better for me. I think that
» would look more natural on my face.
»
» Yeah that is true about how much hairloss affects someone. It has really
» taken a hard grip on my life. Which is pretty sad. And it’s stopped me
» from going after and doing some things I would have otherwise not thought
» twice about. It is definately not an enjoyable experience, but I think I
» am a better person in some ways b/c of having to deal with it. I am
» definately more empathetic to other people’s situations then I was when I
» was younger, but then agian I was in my teens back then. Anyway, it
» really affects me a great deal, and I feel I have a great opportunity to
» do something about it, so I am doing it. This is all very recent really.
» I mean men have been feeling like shit as a result of their hair loss for
» centuries. We are so lucky to live in a time where we can litterly
» reverse mother nature. And Helioboy you are living prood and definately
» an inspiration to many.
»
» I’ve thought a lot about what hair is currently there too, and knowing
» that someday I would have to replace that too. This is really just a band
» aid, and that I will have to get many more band-aids until all is back to
» normal.
»
» Thanks
»
»
»
» » Missmyhair,
» » I’m doing great and glad to be moving on now. Its good to see that you
» » havent made any poor decisions in the past and seeking repair.
» »
» » When I speak of numbers I speak in terms of amounts taken via FUE. To
» me
» » that is the preferred extraction method but there are others here who
» have
» » had good strip experiences and I would have to let them address that
» » option. Based on your crown you appear to need approx. 3000 grafts into
» » your crown area. Your frontal area totally depends on how agressive
» you
» » want your hairline in terms of temporal work and whether you want a
» » ‘closed temple’ or an ‘open’ recessed appearance. Everyone has
» differing
» » expectations based on the facial structure. I personally think a
» closed
» » temple look depicts a more youthful appearance and frames the face
» better
» » verus an open ‘recessed’ look. Again everyone has their opinions on
» this
» » one. I think you should look at 3000-4000 grafts in your frontal area
» to
» » recreate the hairline /temples .
» »
» » In terms of financing I have used your example of car financing many
» times
» » on the forum. I have financed my transplant work and spread it out
» over
» » years to make it affordable for me on a monthly basis .The key to any
» » financing situation is finding affordable interest rates which involved
» » doing some research . It all comes down to how much hair loss affects
» you
» » .
» »
» »
» » I think you are looking at 6000 - 7000 grafts to provide coverage in
» both
» » areas (front and back) . This is only my opinion . You have good
» quality
» » hair to work with . Your midscalp area that currently has good hair now
»
» » would likely need addressing in the future so this is something that
» you
» » should ask about when you are discussing with an M.D . Good luck!!
» »
» » 19,000 grafts by Dr Umar
» » www.myhairtransformation.com