What you need to know

Hair Transplant
61

"You said my opinion was fantasy?

You are a liar you have been caught lying and you do not like it. "

I’m a liar? Are you assuming this or do yo have proof? Wait, assumptions and proof are the same thing, right? Or was it guessing and assumptions were the same? I’m confused. Anyway, why are you asking questions when the answer is in black in white in a previous post?

“Please can you run it by me again how your document you would like to impose on Doctor Woods works again?”

Again? No, I think once was enough. You can just read the first version. It’s still there.

"Whilst your waiting for the Australians to come back to you, perhaps you

could take the time to answer this guys questions about Doctor Vories?"

“Joe posts his advert, but fails to answer the questions below !”

Why? I don’t understand. If you’re concerned about me answering someone else’s question, on a different forum no less, why don’t you just send me a nice email? Wait! I bet it’s because you want to embarrass me, right? Brah-vo! I like your use of the exclamation point, too. It gives your question a really nice conspiracy tone to it.

62

More deflection from Joe as he has been caught lying.

Joe has managed to twist and turn and post a block of text whilst avoiding all questions put to him.

He has avoided all logic and reason and tries to discredit me with a lie

For someone who counts words written by a poster, and is as pedantic as yourself, and attacks doctors on trivialities, to try to boost ones own sense of self importance, there can be no excuse.

YOU LIED JOE , saying I was making things up fantasy as you put it, so you could then in turn, make excuses to leave that argument, one that you were losing.

Whilst hoping to keep your self anointed credibility intact based upon a lie, your lie, if you are lying about this what else are you lying about ?

Here is you`re lie Joe ;

When one has to make things up to support their argument they have no more argument to support. Nowhere in Arfy’s 97 post thread did he say there was a stalemate. This is your word, not his, and by providing the definition of the word stalemate does not make it a stalemate. Arfy did say, in this thread that Dr. Cole “reneged”. I’m done discussing this with you because I won’t debate against fantasy.

Here is the definition of a liar from merriam-webster online whom I think you are familiar with ;

Full Definition of liar
: a person who tells lies

Joe has the arrogance to accuse Doctor Woods of not answering questions, you see Joe`s hypocrisy here!

For Joe to come on a public forum and attack a doctor that has shown an incredible amount of integrity, in the way he approaches hair transplantation, and his patients will attest to this going as far back as twenty years

ago shows that Joe himself has very little integrity.

This also speaks volumes about the doctors that choose him to be their voice and for that they should be ashamed

1. I think he voiced his displeasure and was murdered.
2. I think he voiced his displeasure and was kidnapped.
3. I think he voiced his displeasure and he was abducted by aliens.

Joes logic above that shows he is not capable of providing an opinion on the subject but would rather retreat,
deflect, and hope that the Australian authorities can help him out of the hole he as dug himself!

I do not debate with a LIAR!

63

Ejj,

I’m not clear how my opinion about a statement you made is a lie. What exactly is the lie? How can an opinion be a lie?

I assume you are referring to your summary of our discussion about Arfy…

"You said Dr Cole ended it, I said it was a stalemate, Arfy said he would not agree to signing a gag order without a full refund, its simple really Joe in my opinion a stalemate as stated earlier

You said my opinion was fantasy?

You are a liar you have been caught lying and you do not like it."

YOU SIR are the liar and you have BEEN CAUGHT RED HANDED!!! I did not say Dr. Cole ended the discussions, it was Arfy so YOU ARE A LIAR!!!

(the above was a parody of the accusation and is meant in jest. See how silly this is?)

No, I did not say Dr. Cole ended it. Arfy said Dr. Cole ended it with his comment about how Dr. Cole “reneged” whereas I simply repeated it. You said it was a stalemate and you used Arfy’s comments from over a year ago to invalidate Arfy’s comments from six days ago. “Stalemate” and “reneged” are not synonymous so that is why I called your description of Arfy’s statements a fantasy. Any rational person that subjects themselves to the torture of reading this thread will pick that much out of this.

We still don’t know what Dr. Woods tells his patients to inform them of possible complications or side effects and we don’t know what size punches he uses.

64

Joe you assume to much. Here is you`re lie Joe … AGAIN FOR THE UMPTEENTH TIME !!

Ejj,

I’m not clear how my opinion about a statement you made is a lie. What exactly is the lie? How can an opinion be a lie?

I assume you are referring to your summary of our discussion about Arfy…

When one has to make things up to support their argument they have no more argument to support. Nowhere in Arfy’s 97 post thread did he say there was a stalemate. This is your word, not his, and by providing the definition of the word stalemate does not make it a stalemate. Arfy did say, in this thread that Dr. Cole “reneged”. I’m done discussing this with you because I won’t debate against fantasy.

Joe you lied to mislead. You created a false statement to exit the argument, The false statement was that “I am making things up” I made nothing up I gave an opinion, therefore false …

You even admit this by saying " this is your word not his" so you knew stalemate was my word, my opinion, and still went on to make a false statement saying I was “making things up to support my argument”

I did no such thing therefore a false statement. A false statement used to mislead is in fact a lie, the false statement and lie was used a a pre cursor by yourself to exit the debate, quote “done discussing this with you as wont debate against fantasy” … Thus misleading people as to why you were in fact really leaving the debate …

So a false statement and a lie by you. YOU LIED TO MISLEAD

please see the above, then the below, as I really can`t be bothered explaining this to you anymore, you were lying and you got caught out … simples!

Joe let this go now please as I am almost beginning to feel sorry for you … its embarrassing … for yourself

No more rhetoric, word twisting, deflection, put your thesaurus down, and please just stop, then again you could always just man up, and apologise for lying ?

Dictionary.com thesaurus.com

False statement
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
This article needs additional citations for verification. Please help improve this article by adding citations to reliable sources. Unsourced material may be challenged and removed. (January 2008) (Learn how and when to remove this template message)

A lie is a statement that is known to be untrue and is used to mislead.

lying1
[lahy-ing]
Examples
Word Origin
See more synonyms on Thesaurus.com
noun
1.
the telling of lies, or false statements; untruthfulness:
From boyhood, he has never been good at lying.
Synonyms: falsehood, falsity, mendacity, prevarication.
Antonyms: truth, veracity.
adjective
2.
telling or containing lies; deliberately untruthful; deceitful; false:
a lying report.
Synonyms: deceptive, misleading, mendacious, fallacious; sham, counterfeit.
Antonyms: true, candid, actual, correct, accurate, trustworthy.

Moving on (finally)

Wow Joe really is on the warpath with Doctor Woods. More deflection in the guise of humour ;

(the above was a parody of the accusation and is meant in jest. See how silly this is?)

totally predictable really, followed by more attacks on this doctor from Joe the keyboard Warrior and defender of the hair transplant faith

Again? No, I think once was enough. You can just read the first version. It’s still there

So when we take this back to Dr. Woods’s point about not requiring informed consent for his patients, I think that he is being disingenuous with the subject. If he really wanted to have something to brag about he would not only make informed consent with a signature standard practice in his clinic, he would also enter into a formal agreement, in writing, stating that if the patient is unhappy with their results for any reason, they are free to say as such online with no fear of legal retribution from him, whatsoever, and that this agreement supersedes any other forms the patient may have signed in the clinic that acknowledge informed consent. The patient signs, Dr. Woods signs, everyone wins.

Thank you, it is indeed still there … in all its glory!

Joe attacks Doctor Woods re PRE CONSENT SURGICAL forms because he does not use them, this is his whole and complete reason for being on this thread.

Everything else he says is pure deflection techniques of which he is highly skilled at, he will not stop keep watching, watch him twist and turn …

He has gone to great lengths even making numerous telephone calls to Australia, such is his disdain and anger towards this particular doctor.

Doctor Woods does not require his clients to sign this legal document, and never has done so

Joe wishes to clean up the industry by introducing a document to supersede a document that DOES NOT EVEN EXIST in Doctor Woods practice!</strong> At no point has he suggested he would impose this on his own affiliated list of doctors, were there is in fact a document to be superseded … how hypocritical and telling !

The intention is for the clients being able to discuss anything they wish online … something that they are currently entitled to do anyway, and have been able to do so for a long time with Doctor Woods

He then says this is a win win situation? the mind boggles with Joes logic from aliens kidnappingsandmurdertoconspiracies` against him, is the man deranged ?

He does not need anyone to embarrass him as he has accused me of trying to do, he really does a great job of this himself !

Joes whole attack on Doctor Woods in my opinion is shameful really. He will go to any extremes to enforce his point of view on others, even lying as proven above

I would expect the answer from the Australian authority, that Joe is so desperately waiting on, to try to help him get out of the DO DO he has created to be very pc and non committal, a little like Joes own answers as to why his affiliation with his own doctors ends.

Plenty have asked, only to have the same old vague reply rolled out by Joe, as he himself in turn wishes not to be sued … how ironic !

If I am wrong then I have no problem either admitting so or apologizing, as this is not about me, it is about honesty and transparency, and the wellbeing of others

Joe is to arrogant to even offer an opinion on Marco ( doctor is his former employer) and hides behind nonsense, deflecting any questions, a technique he has often accused others of

and one he himself specialises in.

He has appointed himself as some expert within the industry and assumes his opinions and views are more informed than others

His qualifications are that he is the `most documented hair transplant case out there? How exactly does this qualify him to attack

medical doctors, who have been to medical school and served their time in their profession, or patients with a similar amount or more experience than himself?

He thinks that he himself is some quality control enforcer across this industry, the hair transplant policeman, full of self importance …

He is just a client, a patient, nothing more nothing less … please do not forget this, a bully and liar who believes his own hype

The reality is he thrives on bullying posters with opposing views to his own, he lies when he is caught out much like an ever so slightly more informed school yard bully

He refuses to answer questions that he does not like with remarks like ;

The rest of your post is far too long to quote/argue so I’ll summarize here

He then scrapes the bottom of the barrel, a last resort by suggesting an agenda or conspiracy against him.

He is annoyed when others join in the thread on a public forum, as if his presence and input has suddenly elevated the entire thread to that of two learned and equal opponents

of equal stature and value, two, and it can only be two, according to Joe. The educated opinions, that of a doctor and his equal joetronic, in his deluded world of equal standing, they are not equal, nowhere near

and then he wonders why Doctor Woods humors himself with his putdowns of Joe …

He is a busted flush in my opinion, best avoided

His strategy now will be try to micro-analyze and challenge both the dictionary and myself, he may even count my words to try and worm his way out of being caught out lying, he will twist and turn like a scalded cat and go into mega deflection mode to try to divert from the fact he knowingly made false statements, untruths, which falls within the definition of lying …

I hope my input on this thread helps someone make a better decision. I hope they themselves find this thread and become more informed before deciding upon anything

I hope it stops people making the same mistakes I made

I had no internet many years ago. The information is out there however you have to find it and avoid the pitfalls, people who do not tell the truth are the problem

Joe`s second biggest mistake the first being that he is a liar , is that people like me genuinely only post to help others

Joe is totally incapable of understanding this, it surprises him as he naturally assumes an agenda/ conspiracy ?

No conspiracy or agenda Joe, just good old fashioned compassion, and concern for others, MOST IMPORTANTLY GOOD CONSCIENCE

you struggle to understand this, hence why you throw the term agenda or conspiracy around and auto deflect constantly to try and protect your self appointed position and income stream

it speaks volumes about yourself … projection is the term to describe your behavior I believe … look it up its quite interesting

Joe I would not be able to sleep at night if the garbage that you have spouted on this thread was the reason why someone chose a different doctor over Doctor Woods

much worse, someone in dire need of repair, think about that … As Australia is severely lacking in skilled doctors.

It is called conscience Joe and this is WHY I HAVE POSTED, THE ONE ONLY REASON !

My conscience would trouble me if I allowed you to get away with the utter rubbish and lies you have posted here

I have spoken to many hair transplant clients who have been legally silenced by their doctors, they are out there and for you to suggest otherwise is disingenuous of you

I am happy to sign off now, as I said earlier I don’t want to debate with a liar, and I have exposed Joe as such, and much, … much more …

A busted flush or in Arfys words debunked` quite fitting really.

EJJ OUT
65

Hi Ejj,

I’m not concerned about your claims that I lied because I stated an opinion about your opinion. You can write more pages if you wish but it is what it is. The ”Stalemate" is your opinion based on Arfy’s quote from over a year ago. I believe your opinion of what the situation turned into is inaccurate and self serving whereas I’m simply referencing Arfy’s words used seven days ago. It comes down to you accusing me of lying over what appears to be semantics. You being so steadfast about what Arfy said over a year ago compared to what he said seven days ago is like me holding you to your opinion of me nearly one year ago vs. today. Which would be more current and accurate? It’s a rhetorical question.

“I have spoken to many hair transplant clients who have been legally silenced by their doctors…”

I think the contradiction here is clear.

“…they are out there and for you to suggest otherwise is disingenuous of you.”

You know I suggested no such thing. My consistent message has been that any silencing is not due to any legal allowances granted or acted upon by doctors through informed consent forms because informed consent forms do not make for such allowances. You’re trying to change the subject again.

If you think I’m on the “warpath” to attack Dr. Woods then lets break this down to the relevant basic facts.

  1. I challenged his position on informed consent. He could have explained his position but he instead called me names.

  2. I asked Dr. Woods if he informs his patients about possible side effects and complications that every patient has a right to know. He could have simply said yes or no. He instead talked about starting a reality TV show and said he tells patients about what can happen at other clinics.

  3. I asked him what size punches he uses (if he uses punches) in his surgeries. He said he uses a variety of sizes, but gave no further relevant information.

  4. I have have not criticized his results. I have not criticized his techniques. I have not criticized his passion. I have asked very simple questions that should be easy to answer.

I’m not here to conduct character assassination but you seem Hellbent on doing just that. You are very emotional, and for that I do apologize, but I don’t see what point there is in trying to bully me with unrelated issues. My points stand and no amount of deflection, evasion or bullying about irrelevant subjects will change this.

66

Reading this thread gives me a headache. Joe’s defense of the industry shows what a minefield you are entering when you agree to get this risky and unpredictable medical procedure done.

One thing that Dr. Woods has always had working in his favor are his ethics, something that, in a spectacular understatement, are lacking in the HT industry. No matter how severely you are butchered, trying to gain some measure of recompense for your pain and suffering would mean employing a legal team that would have a less than average chance of success.

It surprises me not one bit that Dr. Woods has been attacked by this sleazy industry of barely competent doctors that make outrageous sums of money for moving hair from the back of ones head to the front, and who often do a poor job of making this look natural. Advances in technology are great, if the practitioner is competent. Too often this work is being done by technicians, assistants, and other unqualified employees working at the doctors behest.

67

Every patient signs a consent form…ie they are having an FUE hair transplant as opposed to a leg amputation.

Every patient is screened for health issues .

Every patient is told a full head of hair is not possible, but good to great density is, depending upon number of procedures

Every patient is told there will be small white dots from follicle removal, and how short they can buzz their hair depends upon how much hair is removed from donor.

Every patient is told ingrown hair and pimples may occur, but will settle and heal.

Every patient is told that 100% of follicles inserted are intact and viable, and CLEARLY MONITORED UNDER HIGH POWER by the patient, friends family etc…I provide a comfy lounge

Every patient is told that the horrible pits, dents, weird angles and cobblestoning will not occur because the techniques , time and effort I use will protect them from this. Infection is incredibly rare, and easily treated by simple antibiotics if it does occur

And all this is on intimate personal well understood VIDEO CONSULTATION TAPE

All is documented, but I do not defend myself from indefensible " industry standard " practices that put patients at obvious risk in order to make a quick easy production line buck.

It’s hard work, and it takes it’s toll, but it is my life and passion to do this right. I will be here for maybe 5 more years and then I’m out.

I will come to LA and NYC in July for the last time to give lectures. I will organise with HAIRSITE etc and hope to see as many of you as I can

I didn’t mean to offend joe…when he put up all that stuff about rassman and others writing me out of history I hope he had a sense of humour when I jokingly discussed my reality tv show , where I will replace jotronic with jilltronic…now how can that be misconstrued as bad taste ?.

Last thought…what happened to Marco ??? The last relevant thing I read was that he invited debate about his situation, but he personally could not comment…interesting. Maybe things have changed, but from being a prolific poster, there is now radio silence.

God forbid, I suggest nothing. What you infer from this is up to you

Dr Woods

68

Hi Dr. Woods,

“Every patient signs a consent form…ie they are having an FUE hair transplant as opposed to a leg amputation.”

So you do in fact have your patients give signed informed consent. I’m sure you’re being sarcastic when you say “as opposed to a leg amputation” and I’m sure you’re more thorough than this. This is no different than any other clinic that requires signed informed consent, contrary to what you’ve been saying all along and most definitely contrary to what some others in this thread have said. Regardless, I consider this settled so thank you for your clarification.

69

my previous post clarified…but I’m not sure your clear on that…read before typing

How is Marco ?

See you in Saint Louis

Dr Woods

70

Marco is likely under a gag order as his case makes it through the rounds of justice, his case was a particularly egregious one that resulted in serious deformation. The necrosis looked severe. I hope he is doing well and ends up being well compensated for his pain and suffering, but no amount of money is worth what this man had to go through.

Hope to hear from him soon. Godspeed Marco. :waving:

71

I think it is very important to recognize that without Dr. Woods, FUE would be well behind where it is today. Dr. Woods put it on the map. We have to give him credit for this. Dr. Rassman was very negative about FUE. Sam Lam is not an expert or a resource on FUE. That’s why i refused to participate in his book that includes many individuals who know very little about FUE. I consider his book essentially worthless.

As far as Arfy goes, he was a repair case and highly successful on that level. The surgery was done for free. What he is complaining about is body hair, which can be unsatisfactory. I advised him against this procedure, yet he elected to proceed. We can’t guarantee body hair and we always advise patients of this. Most patients accept this risk without complaint and sometimes body hair works out very well. We just can’t predict it. Arfy knew this and accepted the risk. I wish it had worked well for him, but at least he did not get worse. He got a little better, which is the most you can hope for in many body hair cases. The only consistent source of body hair is the beard, but we were not doing that due to concerns over scarring over 10 years ago. Still, what we offered at the time was cutting edge surgery that no one else in the world offered.

Many sell FUE today yet lack the skill set to do this surgery. Joe Tillman is right on this. People tend to jump on the band wagon of good procedures even when they lack the skills. Still, the potential for a better aesthetic donor area with FUE is much better than with any strip procedure. What is the real danger for the donor area today is the ARTAS. This thing can destroy a donor area in one pass and produce almost zero in results. So, what you have to do is choose a good FUE surgeon.

72

You charged that man 36K for a hair transplant consisting of 100% leg hair. Not only was your choice of donor a poor one, but even with a 100% growth rate (impossible, of course) the leg hair is too fine to provide anything other than a dusting effect to his appearance. And you never refunded him a dime, even after you promised him a refund.

You are morally and ethically challenged.

73

Cole has done work on me a few times. I asked if we could lower my hairline a cm and he strongly advised against it but I’m sure if I said I wanted it done he’d do it. My visit to another Dr. In NC did not have any issue lowering the hairline. Soon I’ll talk to a 3rd dr. At the end of the day it’s YOUR decision. This is the same as it’s your decision to have a robot do the work.

I’ve lurked for sometime on these forums and I’m surprised arfy was not hit with a liber suit. He’s done nothing but troll the forums and I’m not exactly sure what his end state goal is. Even though Cole has done an amazing job on me I have no choice but to look at him differently. I hope arfy finds peace or $36k this hair loss can be devastating. My experience with Cole was completely different. Unfortunately life is full of risk.

74

[quote][postedby]Originally Posted by Hicks[/postedby]

I’ve lurked for sometime on these forums and I’m surprised arfy was not hit with a liber suit. He’s done nothing but troll the forums and I’m not exactly sure what his end state goal is.[/quote]

A libel suit? For explaining, in great detail, what his surgical experience was with Dr. Cole? On some forums you are not permitted to reveal these issues in depth, which shows some forums are so wedded to the industry that they want to sweep results like these under the rug, lest they threaten the revenue stream.

He has not libeled anyone, he has presented an extremely well documented case of a HT failure on almost every level, from the planning, to the procedure, to the end result, and to the follow up care, his was an utter failure on each level. To pursue legal action for presenting this would likely backfire on the part of the plaintiff, as it would reveal before the judicial system just why his claims are true.

75

Wylie posts comments about Dr. Cole as if he has a Ph.D in the study of Dr. Cole in some alternate reality. I took Dr. Cole’s patient photos for several years and have known him since 2003. His camera and photography setup isn’t optimal. His patients look better in person than they do in the photographs. Although DC is difficult to work with, he does great work. I was a repair patient before I went to work at his practice. Dr. Cole did a lot more work for me than I paid for. I got very good growth with beard and it looks natural.

76

the industry must be held to account and bound by the chains of ethics,competency honesty and morals. But most importantly, FREE SPEECH…as long as what you say or show is honest, truthful and provable…and you can back it up with indesputable evidence in a court of law, no legal disclaimer should bind you to silence.

On the other hand, if someone posts incorrect, defamatory and unjustified information that cannot be substantiated,or uses the internet and emails for their own means, may the heavy hand of the law decend upon them…hilary excluded

Dr Woods