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Prostaglandin D2 (PGD2)


#1

#2

Check out this guys blog, he is using a multi pronged approach but I can’t believe it, it actually seems to be working.


#3

Definitely shows growth, but let’s be realistic, it’s minimal.


#4

Better than the no regrowth I see with every other option. He only just added got the Setipiprant a few weeks ago I think, prior to that has been using things like castor oil as a PGE2 agonist.

Looks like it’s filling in quite nicely to me?


#5

[quote]Better than the no regrowth I see with every other option. He only just added got the Setipiprant a few weeks ago I think, prior to that has been using things like castor oil as a PGE2 agonist.

Looks like it’s filling in quite nicely to me? [/quote]

Wow. :surprised:

If that temple area was bald longer than 1-2 years then he’s getting some serious regrowth.

That result is not comparable to a 24yo guy starting Finasteride and thickening up his crown spot. That temple skin is an area that does NOT like to regrow EVER. And some of those hairs actually look (barely) terminal rather than vellus. IMO that could be a sign of something really promising.


#6

Roger, this is the SwissTemples, poster I told you about. He is completely filling in his bald temples. Face it, you’re wrong. And this is what RU did for me for awhile. And this is why I have guarded hope for SM04554.

He actually got this regrowth without setipiprant. He just started setipiprant recently and this picture was taken before he started it. He got the regrowth from other interventions. And this proves my point that there are ways to make hair regrow without implanting cells.

And this is all the more reason why we should go to the Hair Loss Congress to see if there’s news about SM04554.


#7

Yeah, that was pretty much my reaction, the guy said he starting balding at 17 and he was on Fin for 6 years and had no temple growth, so it has been slick bald for ages. I can’t understand why people aren’t more excited about it. I don’t know this guy at all but he has gone to great depths to research the prostaglandin pathway and try to counteract it experimentally and has gotten tangible results that aren’t just vellus hairs. Not only that but he has gone to the bother of documenting it. So frequently experimental things on hairloss forums show promise but nobody ever documents their progress or they give up too soon. As Jarjar said he got most of these results without even using setipiprant. I can only hope/imagine that the temples will gain ground as he has only been at it for a few months. And i’ll echo his comment, this is showing that with a strategic approach, you can grow hair in areas that have been slick bald for years, which is awesome.

I’ve looked at this forum for 8 years or so, and I’ve yet to see anything that grew any temple hair, there’s all this promise from the big companies but they always hang around for a few years, show theoretical promise, we never see any results and then we’re back at square one.

I for one, am cautiously excited, and I’ve yet to feel that way about anything else I’ve seen.


#8

Thick terminal.
Thin terminal.
Vellus.
Recently shiny skin.
Long-term shiny skin.

There are about 5 stages of this process.

The traditional known MPB regimens can always seem to cross 1 or 2 of the stages. It’s not even remarkable to see 2 stages crossed. But after 2 stages we always hit an absolute brick wall. WE NEVER, EVER, EVER MAKE IT PAST THAT.

It seems like this guy may actually be pushing 4 of the 5 stages here. This is new. Even on the crown it would be impressive. On the temples it’s mind-blowing.


#9

I submit that all this commotion over this guy is ridiculous. His results are nothing unusual, in fact, they are much worse and less compelling than hundreds of cases you can see on the internet, with Rogaine, Propecia, etc.

Rogaine, Propecia, Finasteride before and afters -

https://www.google.com/search?q=rogaine+before+after&biw=1002&bih=441&tbm=isch&img

https://www.google.com/search?q=rogaine+before+after&biw=1002&bih=441&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&sqi=2&ved=0CAYQ_AUoAWoVChMIwtTF5cqXyAIVi4-ACh3rfgjq

THAT is just the tip of the iceberg.

The ONLY reason people get excited about this stuff is because it is NEW.

If Rogaine was new (e.g., people just started testing it on themselves within the past year or so), and a few people got great results, I guarantee you’d see people just like you guys here going crazy on the forums, about how they’ve never seen anything like this before.

And this guy’s results don’t even compare to the best seen from Rogaine.

The problem with all these topicals is that they produce wildly varying results on different people. Most only grow peach fuzz, a few get noticeable terminal hairs, and an even smaller percentage of those manage to cover in balding spots with considerable terminal hair. But that’s ALWAYS a small minority.

And again, this guy’s results don’t even compare to the best we’ve ALREADY seen with Minoxidil and other readily available drugs.

Get real, people!! Remember “The Emperor’s New Clothes”? This is exactly like that.

This guy has confused and confounded a lot of people by talking a lot of complicated nonsense on his blog, blurring the issue with meaningless accusations (they ALWAYS attack the people on the “forums” who are know-it-alls… OLD tactic beaten to death on Spencer’s show). Swisstemple has also confused everything by showing photos with different angles, different lighting, sunburned skin, etc.

I challenge any of you to get Swisstemple’s absolute worst, earliest “before” pic, and his absolute best “after” pic, and put them side-by-side here on the forum (in a single post).

SIDE BY SIDE.

And I will find you 10 sets of before/after pics using Rogaine where the results are clearly much better.


#10

Yawn, of course people get excited over it because it’s new. That’s what we’re all here for isn’t it? If the ‘big 3’ were that great then none of us would be here, would we? This guy tried the big 3 and maintained at best, and he’s getting regrowth with something new. If that’s not interesting or exciting to you, fine, but for the rest of us, it is. I couldn’t care less how regrowth is achieved, as long as it works.

Also you don’t need to type in block capitals or bold to highlight your points, we can all read.


#11

Yes there are occasional rare cases where people get major results from minoxidil and/or propecia, but Swisstemples tried those things and they did not work for him. Let me say that again, Swisstemples tried propecia and minoxidil but they did not work for him. He is not one of the people who’s hair loss is easy to reverse substantially. So that means he is one of the people who needs something better. He’s one of us unfortunates.

And this also supports my claim that RU58841 worked a heck of a lot better on me than Propecia and minoxidil combined. I got the same results with RU58841 that Swisstemples is getting with his regimen. I got virtually no regrowth with finasteride combined with minoxidil.

Dutasteride and finasteride work on only one androgen - DHT. But RU58841 works on ALL androgens. I submit that the hair loss cascade of events caused by androgens can be almost entirely stopped by RU58841 because RU58841 negates all of the types of androgens, but that cascade of events can only be somewhat inhibited by 5-alpha reductase finasteride or dutasteride because finasteride and dutasteride only negate one androgen. Hence, you get better results with RU58841 than dutasteride or finasteride.

My theory:

The things that Swisstemples is doing work downstream from anti-androgen therapy on the same treatment pathway. And Wnt stimulation is near the end of that treatment pathway, just before the point of SHH, which is followed by cellular prolifation. In other words, using antiandrogens may lead to “B”, which leads to “C”, which leads to “D”, (etcetera) until you get to the point that you stimulate Wnts, which then leads to SHH, which is followed by cellular proliferation. The point is to get to hair cell proliferation. And if you can use this treatment pathway to get the cells to proliferate then you don’t need to trouble yourself with implanting S & B cells.

Samumed has a Wnt stimulating topical in clinical trials and their investigators will be at the HLC. As I have repeatedly said, I believe that we should send a couple of people to the HLC to collect detailed information.


#12

oh come on people. we are obviously talking about a hoax here.
i did visit the blog. i saw all the pictures there.
the hand/fingers holding the hair back in the after pictures are different … very hairy compared to the ones in the before pictures. BUT basically the hairline …is different. we are talking about two different persons here.
i hope i am wrong, but i doubt this is legit.


#13

[quote][postedby]Originally Posted by fastfuse[/postedby]
oh come on people. we are obviously talking about a hoax here.
i did visit the blog. i saw all the pictures there.
the hand/fingers holding the hair back in the after pictures are different … very hairy compared to the ones in the before pictures. BUT basically the hairline …is different. we are talking about two different persons here.
i hope i am wrong, but i doubt this is legit.[/quote]

Since you hope that you are wrong you should be happy to know that you ARE wrong.


#14

[quote][postedby]Originally Posted by TylerDurden[/postedby]
Yawn, of course people get excited over it because it’s new. That’s what we’re all here for isn’t it? If the ‘big 3’ were that great then none of us would be here, would we? This guy tried the big 3 and maintained at best, and he’s getting regrowth with something new. If that’s not interesting or exciting to you, fine, but for the rest of us, it is. I couldn’t care less how regrowth is achieved, as long as it works.[/quote]

Have to totally disagree with you and Jarjar here.

First, I am all for new treatments. That’s always been why I think this is such an important forum. I am NOT saying that anything in the current arsenal is good enough. Far from it. To repeat myself, the vast majority of people who’ve used Rogaine, Propecia, Dutasteride, etc. do not get spectacular results. If they’re just starting to lose hair, they can maintain what they have for a while. If they’ve already lost a lot, it’s much more likely than not they will not be able to recover everything they’ve lost. Again, most see peach fuzz or a few sparse terminal hairs, at best.

My point was that although that’s what the majority get, there are still hundreds if not thousands of anecdotal cases where people who are already significantly bald, do regain a considerable amount of hair.

But of all the people who use these drugs (millions), even thousands is still a small minority.

And both you and Jarjar point to Swisstemple as if he’s some big archetype and model patient who will represent the response in everyone else who uses his regimen.

Why should we assume that? He is just a single data point. To make any kind of valid inferences, any scientist will tell you that you need a bit more than one data point.

After all the hype surrounding this guy, he’s still just one person, and these results most likely represent an anecdotal response specific to him.

That said, the results are still not objectively that good. People need to take the cotton out of their eyes and have another good, clear look at those photos.

Yes, part of the triangular bald area at the temples has filled in. But the hair that’s filled in is still FAR from original density. I would not be happy with those results for all the time and effort put into doing that. All the countless hours spent in front of the mirror.

Been there, done that.

If you think this is so great, do it yourself and report your results here.

I will not waste my time on it, until Setipiprant is clinically proven, or at least until I see much better results from self-experimenters than this.


#15

I’m with you Roger. I will believe this when I see results from a clinical trial. However, this company must know something we don’t.


#16

[quote][postedby]Originally Posted by TylerDurden[/postedby]
Yawn, of course people get excited over it because it’s new. That’s what we’re all here for isn’t it? If the ‘big 3’ were that great then none of us would be here, would we? This guy tried the big 3 and maintained at best, and he’s getting regrowth with something new. If that’s not interesting or exciting to you, fine, but for the rest of us, it is. I couldn’t care less how regrowth is achieved, as long as it works.

[postedby]Originally Posted by roger_that[/postedby]

Have to totally disagree with you and Jarjar here.

First, I am all for new treatments. That’s always been why I think this is such an important forum. I am NOT saying that anything in the current arsenal is good enough. Far from it. To repeat myself, the vast majority of people who’ve used Rogaine, Propecia, Dutasteride, etc. do not get spectacular results. If they’re just starting to lose hair, they can maintain what they have for a while. If they’ve already lost a lot, it’s much more likely than not they will not be able to recover everything they’ve lost. Again, most see peach fuzz or a few sparse terminal hairs, at best.

My point was that although that’s what the majority get, there are still hundreds if not thousands of anecdotal cases where people who are already significantly bald, do regain a considerable amount of hair.

But of all the people who use these drugs (millions), even thousands is still a small minority.

And both you and Jarjar point to Swisstemple as if he’s some big archetype and model patient who will represent the response in everyone else who uses his regimen.

Why should we assume that? He is just a single data point. To make any kind of valid inferences, any scientist will tell you that you need a bit more than one data point.

After all the hype surrounding this guy, he’s still just one person, and these results most likely represent an anecdotal response specific to him.

That said, the results are still not objectively that good. People need to take the cotton out of their eyes and have another good, clear look at those photos.

Yes, part of the triangular bald area at the temples has filled in. But the hair that’s filled in is still FAR from original density. I would not be happy with those results for all the time and effort put into doing that. All the countless hours spent in front of the mirror.

Been there, done that.

If you think this is so great, do it yourself and report your results here.

I will not waste my time on it, until Setipiprant is clinically proven, or at least until I see much better results from self-experimenters than this.[/quote]

Again, would you please stop typing using cap locks and bold, I can read, it comes across as incredibly passive aggressive and it’s unnecessary, because again, I can read. I’m not sure what your problem is but the tone of your messages are incredibly hostile.

I merely posted to the link and said that it seemed to be working and that I was excited by it. I didn’t make other claims or assumptions that you’re saying I am. Your ridiculous, patronising diatribe is exactly the reason this forum is basically dead and nobody really discusses anything; the second you say anything remotely positive you get jumped on, I’m not interested in having it out with you, it’s a waste of energy.


#17

I’ll tell you what, you type your posts the way you want to, and I’ll type mine the way I want to.


#18

I agree with you that Roger is wrong on the merits. I would even go so far as to say that it’s obvious that he’s definitely wrong on the merits. But to hassle him about using caps and bold type so he can emphasize points is really unfair. Hairsite put caps and bold type functions in the forum so people could use them for the exact purpose that Roger is using them - to emphasize specific points.


#19

Please!!! There is NEVER going to be a clinical trial for Swisstemple’s regimen. Nobody owns that regimen.

But the success Swisstemples is having does add to the body of evidence that you don’t have to go to all the trouble of producing large amounts of the right hair-inductive cells and then implant those cells into the scalp in order to regrow hair. You could instead just find ways to prompt the follicles inside the scalp to produce more of the correct cells inside of the scalp. That’s what Swisstemple’s is doing. That’s what I did with RU58841. Roger’s wrong and so are you.


#20

Show me a huge pile of good big-3 results. I will probably show you a huge pile of results that only backed up the process by 1 or 2 of the stages I laid out.

This does matter. This has a lot to do with WHY one person gets huge visible regrowth from the big-3 and another gets very little.

Regrowing 10 new dark terminal hairs on long-bald shiny hairline skin is a bigger accomplishment than bringing back 1000 crown hairs that were just recently withering away.