“a boost after transplant to the scalp. Does not change characteristics” I think the problem here is a play on words. Length is a charecteristic of a hair.Yes there are others. But that is the only thing Dr. Woods has said at the presentations. I was there and I saw the results of the chest and back hair and the donor sites. After the first round of Timetesteds bht and about a year and a half later to view the yield and the new bht that was just planted . That was some 4 years ago and it is still growing. I would like to see if not from you Optimists final results. Be educational to the boards don’t you think?
» “a boost after transplant to the scalp. Does not change characteristics” I
» think the problem here is a play on words. Length is a charecteristic of a
» hair.Yes there are others. But that is the only thing Dr. Woods has said at
» the presentations. I was there and I saw the results of the chest and back
» hair and the donor sites. After the first round of Timetesteds bht and
» about a year and a half later to view the yield and the new bht that was
» just planted . That was some 4 years ago and it is still growing. I would
» like to see if not from you Optimists final results. Be educational to the
» boards don’t you think?
Dear Franklin,
I do not know why you insist on Optimist. he had stated from the start that he is not comfortable posting pictures.
Moreover, I do not breath down the neck of my patients to post their update.
That a large number of them have done so, nonetheless, should tell you something.
There is a very big difference between saying that the length increased and suggesting that the BH took over the characteristic of scalp hair length. Misleading maybe a kind and generous word in this regard.
No wonder Dr. Woods had his lawyer in tow during the US visit you talk of.
However, I do not like that approach. For me, a patient becomes a part of my life. Therefore, I speak what I have honestly observed and do not rely on semantics. I suggest you do the same.
My apologies, I forgot, you are not the doctor in question. Somehow, you show up when i ask him a direct question. Disconcerting! yours, Dr. A
»
» 抚州灼中影视文化发展公司
»
» 抚州灼中影视文化发展公司
»
»
»
» Yes of course, BHT has been shown to work already.
»
» 4. DHT inhibitors such as finasteride and dutasteride are
» frequently used by hair loss sufferers. Frequent reports of body hair
» reduction in users of these medications should be highlighted to all
» prospective BHT patients by all BHT providers. While this information may
» impact on the number of ideal BHT candidates, a fully informed patient
» considering BHT would know this at this time.
»
»
» S. Umar, M.D., FAAD
» DermHair Clinic
» Redondo Beach, California
» +1-310-318-1500
» 1-877-DERMHAIR (US residents)
» info@dermhairclinic.com
» www.dermhairclinic.com
» Single Follicule Extraction & Transfer (SFET)
» Using Head and Body hair
Dear friend,
You are on the right track. But you are wrong on certain aspects.
The different types of donor hair being just one.
Regards,
D. A
» »
» »
» 抚州灼中影视文化发展公司
» »
» »
» 抚州灼中影视文化发展公司
» »
» »
» »
» » Yes of course, BHT has been shown to work already.
» »
» » 4. DHT inhibitors such as finasteride and dutasteride are
» » frequently used by hair loss sufferers. Frequent reports of body hair
» » reduction in users of these medications should be highlighted to all
» » prospective BHT patients by all BHT providers. While this information
» may
» » impact on the number of ideal BHT candidates, a fully informed patient
» » considering BHT would know this at this time.
» »
» »
» » S. Umar, M.D., FAAD
» » DermHair Clinic
» » Redondo Beach, California
» » +1-310-318-1500
» » 1-877-DERMHAIR (US residents)
» » info@dermhairclinic.com
» » www.dermhairclinic.com
» » Single Follicule Extraction & Transfer (SFET)
» » Using Head and Body hair
»
» Dear friend,
» You are on the right track. But you are wrong on certain aspects.
» The different types of donor hair being just one.
» I have and will take my responsibilty as your teacher seriously. I do not
» want misunderstandings at this time.
» Let me know if you face any problems.
» Regards,
» D. A
Just make sure you are not regurgitating ideas derived from me in the process.
S. Umar, M.D., FAAD
DermHair Clinic
Redondo Beach, California
+1-310-318-1500
1-877-DERMHAIR (US residents)
info@dermhairclinic.com
Single Follicule Extraction & Transfer (SFET)
Using Head and Body hair
» Dear forum readers,
» Some logical points -
»
» 1. The transplanted scalp donor hair do not adopt the characteristics of
» the fine temple hair even when they are transplanted to the temples.
»
» 2. The transplanted “robust” beard hair did not take on the scalp hair
» characteristics in the forum poster “programmer” for years.
»
» 3. If the transplanted hair take on recipient area characteristics, then
» the requirement of “robustness” is moot. Each and every hair will take on
» the characteristics.
»
» 4. The transplanted scalp hair in the eyebrows retain their own
» characteristics, necessitating frequent trimming on part of the patient.
»
» What happens, most likely, is that the transplanted hair retain their own
» characteristics, but the transplanted body hair may get a boost. Much like
» a plant placed in a more fertile soil.
»
» That is very different from claims about transplanted body hair taking on
» scalp hair characteristics.
»
» For reasons beyond my comprehension, early BHT proponents seemed to push
» this myth of BH taking on scalp hair characteristics.
»
» I feel that is an utterly wrong way to present BHT.
» BHT is close to my heart, but its benefits can be best acheived by
» unravelling its natural laws.
» Not by simplistic pronouncements.
»
» Regards,
» Dr. A
I can speak from experience as Ive taken finasteride for a decade, and have piddled with dutasteride in roughly a one year period a while back. Finas kept me from getting “hairier”. I kept about the same amount of body hair. Dutasteride however, lessened the lenght and caliber or my body hair a little bit. Nothing shocking, but there was a small decrease.
About six months ago, I started using spiro and revivogen on my head to see if there would be a big shed or anything. I have plenty of finas if something like that started to happen. It did not, but my arms and legs and chest are now hairier as a result. Id be an extremely hairy man by now if I’d never taken finas all those years, but I’d probably also be a NW4 or so if I didnt also instead of a 2.5-3. I’ll probably start using the finas/nizoral combo alone again before long because topicals are a pain.
One thing that might help body hair are things the repress Dermal papilla inhibitors directly. The apple poly proanthocyandins that suppress Protien Kinease C and TGF-beta 1 and 2 are not anti-androgenic. They might really help body hair grow more if used without any pyrixidione HCL (vitamin b6, which suppresses androgen receptor expression) or tocopherol (also known to somewhat supress receptor expression). Silica, which inhibits the negative dermal papilla growth factor IL-1, might also help the body hair have longer growth phases (although it would be exceedingly unwise to get the silica from onion juice, becuase it supresses receptor expression also due to the quercitin content therein).
We are learning what the positive and negative growth factors secreted by the dermal papilla are.
TGF beta 1,2, and 3
Protien Kinease C (PKC)
Thrombospondin
IL-1
FGF-5
are what are KONWN to supresse HUMAN (not rat’s) hair follicle cells at this point. Usage of inhibitors of these that ARE NOT anti-androgenic (like green tea for TGF beta), probably would help the body hair stay in the anagen phase longer than it would otherwise.
Grapeseed extract proanthocyandins (c-1), apple proanthocyandins (b-2), Silica (IL-1), might aid in this.
» » »
» » »
» »
» 抚州灼中影视文化发展公司
» » »
» » »
» »
» 抚州灼中影视文化发展公司
» » »
» » »
» » »
» » » Yes of course, BHT has been shown to work already.
» » »
» » » 4. DHT inhibitors such as finasteride and dutasteride are
» » » frequently used by hair loss sufferers. Frequent reports of body hair
» » » reduction in users of these medications should be highlighted to all
» » » prospective BHT patients by all BHT providers. While this information
» » may
» » » impact on the number of ideal BHT candidates, a fully informed
» patient
» » » considering BHT would know this at this time.
» » »
» » »
» » » S. Umar, M.D., FAAD
» » » DermHair Clinic
» » » Redondo Beach, California
» » » +1-310-318-1500
» » » 1-877-DERMHAIR (US residents)
» » » info@dermhairclinic.com
» » » www.dermhairclinic.com
» » » Single Follicule Extraction & Transfer (SFET)
» » » Using Head and Body hair
» »
I am not unfamiliar with problems in professional and corporate relationships and have become embroiled on numerous occasions, reacted and then seen as the bad guy when it has been my detractors that were deceitful. There is usually a good guy and a bad guy and to the outside world it is usually impossible to make the call.
All I can say is that it is tragic that although we assume each one of you has great integrity, you do not trust these qualities in each other and you are indeed the experts.
So it seems that our judgments are bad and it is not safe to trust our hair with even those that I thought was beyond deceit otherwise so common in the HT industry.
I don’t know it’s just tragic for all us guys.
» I am not unfamiliar with problems in professional and corporate
» relationships and have become embroiled on numerous occasions, reacted and
» then seen as the bad guy when it has been my detractors that were
» deceitful. There is usually a good guy and a bad guy and to the outside
» world it is usually impossible to make the call.
»
» All I can say is that it is tragic that although we assume each one of you
» has great integrity, you do not trust these qualities in each other and you
» are indeed the experts.
»
» So it seems that our judgments are bad and it is not safe to trust our
» hair with even those that I thought was beyond deceit otherwise so common
» in the HT industry.
»
»
» I don’t know it’s just tragic for all us guys.
Pretty scary, that’s why I’m waiting. You really don’t know who to trust. Most of these doctors have a few posters who are constantly praising their work, or arguing in their favor. They are former patients, and it’s hard to figure the whole thing out.
In 1999, the patient “htveteran” walked into my office. He had a terrible strip scar which left his donor. severely damaged . The scar was so broad it was unconcealable
The front of his head was also severely scarred from an accident, and from HT surgery.
It was a hot day and he wore a loose shirt.
As I told him there was nothing anyone could do, I looked at his short, curly and thick chest har, and thought to myself.
As he waited for a cab in my carpark, I looked at him through my window. He was extremely depressed and unhappy, as there was no hope…
I thought that even if I could harvest chest hair, it would look unnatural, due to its different characteristics.
But then I thought, what the hell, cut short, no one will know , and it could conceal disfiguring scars.
I ran into the carpark, told him my plan, and dragged him back into the office.
I performed multiple procedures on several different patients from around the world in the 1999 to 2000 period, and told everyone, KEEP YOUR HAIR BUZZ CUT SHORT.
I warned that if all the hair grew out long, the body hair would look DIFFERENT and out of place, and “clash” with pre existing hair.
Then a patient from Europe called. I asked “ keeping it all short….?
He replied “Dr Woods, its long and it ALL looks the same”.
I called “htveteran”, but he followed orders and kept it short.
Then I called “Justin”. He let all the hair grow and said, “ its about 5 inches….ALL of it “
I was at his house within an hour with video cameras and a ruler. The rest is history
Since that day, I advise all body hair patients to grow it as long as it will go, if they wish.
And I repeat…, IF the appropriate body hair is CHOSEN and HARVESTED correctly, and IF it is planted correctly, then it assumes the characteristics of pre existing hair, from which you cannot tell the difference
And basically, that is all that matters.
As far as the “lawyer” is concerned, he was a friend of Spencer Kobren of “the bald truth” radio program. He appeared on that program in 1999 /2000 discussing his own baldness and the horror of having to wear a hairpiece.
He knew Farrell as well , but Spencer recommended that he came to us .
He had a fabulous result, threw away his hair piece, and appeared on Spencers show broadcasting from LA in 2002.
He became a friend and showed his results at several seminars in LA and NY since 2002, and was inspected by David from Hairsite personally.
All those years of experience and observation leads to the conclusion that ;
-
weak soft short flimsy hair, such as weak leg hair, will look like vellous hair on the head, albeit slightly longer in some cases
-
The longer and thicker the body hair, the longer and more dense it appears on the scalp
In short, body hair will blend in and be indistinguishable from head hair, and proportionately increase in length.
But the RULE OF THUMB when considering a body hair transplant IS
“WHAT YOU SEE IS WHAT YOU WILL GET”
Dr Ray Woods
» Pretty scary, that’s why I’m waiting. You really don’t know who to trust.
» Most of these doctors have a few posters who are constantly praising their
» work, or arguing in their favor. They are former patients, and it’s hard to
» figure the whole thing out. Top Cat all you would want to do is ask the doctor to get in touch with the former patients for which procedure you would be considering. Yes it’s a lot of work but it’s elective surgery. It costs time and yes some money too if you have to travel. But well worth it for piece of mind. Did I call the office and ask Dr. Woods all the questions and for contacts before I went.? You bet I did . And I would encourage all to do the same before going to any doc they are interested in.Just do not rely on what you read here. Some are very good at advertising they are on these boards every day.
» » Dear friend,
» » You are on the right track. But you are wrong on certain aspects.
» » The different types of donor hair being just one.
» »
» » Regards,
» » D. A
»
»
» Just make sure you are not regurgitating ideas derived from me in the
» process.
Dr. Umar,
Whatever gives you the idea that knowledge is a preserve of a chosen few.
I can vouch that Dr. A has the most comprehensive training program in hair transplant. We have discussions, case studies and presentations. Learning here is not based solely on what a lone doctor may notice working through the night.
You recently noticed multiple hair groupings near knee. I was taught that this is usual in one of the first BHT surgeries I saw at our centre almost an year ago.
I have seen what havoc dermatologists/plastic surgeons wreck on their patients.
Dr. A is a gentleman who will not stoop to answering these sort of posts. But I felt it necessary to give you this advise.
Now, we should stick to the topic being discussed.
edit
» » » »
» » » »
» » »
» »
» 抚州灼中影视文化发展公司
» » » »
» » » »
» » »
» »
» 抚州灼中影视文化发展公司
» » » »
» » » »
» » » »
» » » » Yes of course, BHT has been shown to work already.
» » » »
» » » » 4. DHT inhibitors such as finasteride and dutasteride are
» » » » frequently used by hair loss sufferers. Frequent reports of body
» hair
» » » » reduction in users of these medications should be highlighted to
» all
» » » » prospective BHT patients by all BHT providers. While this
» information
» » » may
» » » » impact on the number of ideal BHT candidates, a fully informed
» » patient
» » » » considering BHT would know this at this time.
» » » »
» » » »
» » » » S. Umar, M.D., FAAD
» » » » DermHair Clinic
» » » » Redondo Beach, California
» » » » +1-310-318-1500
» » » » 1-877-DERMHAIR (US residents)
» » » » info@dermhairclinic.com
» » » » www.dermhairclinic.com
» » » » Single Follicule Extraction & Transfer (SFET)
» » » » Using Head and Body hair
» » »
» » » Dear friend,
» » » You are on the right track. But you are wrong on certain aspects.
» » » The different types of donor hair being just one.
» » » I have and will take my responsibilty as your teacher seriously. I do
» » not
» » » want misunderstandings at this time.
» » » Let me know if you face any problems.
» » » Regards,
» » » D. A
» »
» »
» »
» »
» »
» » Just make sure you are not regurgitating ideas derived from me in the
» » process. Avoid also exposing excessive ignorance in the field of
» » dermatology and endocrinology in the process… It embarrasses us all.
» »
» » There is a problem when a self proclaimed expert in a field considers
» » internet chat rooms the primary source of knowledge.
» »
» » As you continue to learn and improve on your FUE and BHT skills and
» » techniques, you would understand why donor sealing is useless.
» » Your patients would at that stage start experiencing the beauty of
» self
» » sealing which has nothing to do with hydrating lotions. Let me know
» » when you have reached that stage.
» »
» »
» » Many in the forums including myself have been fooled by con artists and
» » deceitful marketeers.
» »
» » “Friendship” does not come cheaply or by way of deceit. Please let us
» » economize that term.
» »
» »
» »
» »
» »
» » S. Umar, M.D., FAAD
» » DermHair Clinic
» » Redondo Beach, California
» » +1-310-318-1500
» » 1-877-DERMHAIR (US residents)
» » info@dermhairclinic.com
» » www.dermhairclinic.com
» » Single Follicule Extraction & Transfer (SFET)
» » Using Head and Body hair. Wow big change of tone in the former
» alliance
» .Yes just show the convincing results!!!
When a patient comes to me for body hair, he will ask the most important question.
WILL IT LOOK LIKE NORMAL SCALP HAIR ???
And the answer is , the length may be less, but otherwise, YES.
Neither the patient nor the observer will detect that it is indeed BODY HAIR.
If they did, I would not be doing this BHT procedure for the last 8 years.
And in the real world, that is ALL that matters, and that is all I care about.
I hope that satisfies Dr Arvind’s curiosity . IT IS WHAT REALLY MATTERS, and micro variations are insignificant, irrelevent and given all the other confounding variables, utterly negligable.
And now I have a question for Dr Arvind
Did you really perform 6000 body hair grafts on Dr UMAR ??. If so, why is there no result for anyone to see ??
If you claimed 600 “U” shaped intact grafts, I would have been impressed that you could do it. Amazed !
But claiming 6000…?? In my opinion , that is misleading. Even more misleading than your “donor sealing” etc etc etc
You used this amazing publicity stunt to attack me.
NOW, please, lets see.
Dr Ray Woods
PS I find grubby confrontations like this distasteful, but with the appearance of Dr Arvind, they are unfortunately unavoidable
» When a patient comes to me for body hair, he will ask the most important
» question.
»
» WILL IT LOOK LIKE NORMAL SCALP HAIR ???
»
» And the answer is , the length may be less, but otherwise, YES.
»
» Neither the patient nor the observer will detect that it is indeed BODY
» HAIR.
»
» If they did, I would not be doing this BHT procedure for the last 8
» years.
»
» And in the real world, that is ALL that matters, and that is all I care
» about.
»
» I hope that satisfies Dr Arvind’s curiosity . IT IS WHAT REALLY MATTERS,
» and micro variations are insignificant, irrelevent and given all the other
» confounding variables, utterly negligable.
»
» And now I have a question for Dr Arvind
»
» Did you really perform 6000 body hair grafts on Dr UMAR ??. If so, why is
» there no result for anyone to see ??
»
» If you claimed 600 “U” shaped intact grafts, I would have been impressed
» that you could do it. Amazed !
» But claiming 6000…?? In my opinion , that is misleading. Even more
» misleading than your “donor sealing” etc etc etc
»
» You used this amazing publicity stunt to attack me.
» NOW, please, lets see.
»
» Dr Ray Woods
»
» PS I find grubby confrontations like this distasteful, but with the
» appearance of Dr Arvind, they are unfortunately unavoidable. Ahh this again? Ok there appears to be some posters on other sites that have seen Dr. Umars results. Can someone post a photo already? And we can get on with this old discussion.
» When a patient comes to me for body hair, he will ask the most important
» question.
»
» WILL IT LOOK LIKE NORMAL SCALP HAIR ???
»
» And the answer is , the length may be less, but otherwise, YES.
»
» Neither the patient nor the observer will detect that it is indeed BODY
» HAIR.
»
» If they did, I would not be doing this BHT procedure for the last 8
» years.
»
» And in the real world, that is ALL that matters, and that is all I care
» about.
»
» I hope that satisfies Dr Arvind’s curiosity . IT IS WHAT REALLY MATTERS,
» and micro variations are insignificant, irrelevent and given all the other
» confounding variables, utterly negligable.
»
I disagree.
Its true that transplanted body hair blend in nicely with the transplanted scalp hair.
But, the other variables are not irrelevant nor negligible. It is important for the operating physician to be aware of them and to factor them in planning the BHT.
Hair cycles is the most important of them.
Dr. Woods, do you wish to state that hair cycles do not matter when the difference between hair cycles of scalp and body hair is so huge.
Or, do you wish to state that the transplanted body hair cycles change to those of scalp hair?
As for results, our clinic has shown numerous cases of ONLY BHT and that too the finer calibre hair on a slick bald patient scalp.
The patient Sphinx is one example. (Fortunately for us, 
he is not another HT doctor, just a patient).
http://www.hairsite4.com/dc/dcboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=12&topic_id=52052&mode=full
No of grafts - 7000.
Type of grafts - Only body hair.
Pre HT Baldness status- NW 6.
7000 BHT grafts transplanted in Feb 2006.
The after pictures are from 1 year later, that is Feb 2007.
» » » Concerning the donor sealing… I think that thereis good reason to have some type of post operative closure, in FUE/FIT. I think you guys are attacking it the wrong way though. Shrink the extraction sites as much as possible before they begin to heal. That acts like a suture by having the extraction sites not fill with scar tissue… or at least decrease it as much as possible.
»
Dr Woods,
for the record I do think that your ability to extract grafts via FUE is second to none.
I also believe (indeed, I personally see it as unarguable) that you are the true FUE pioneer and that without your efforts FUE would not be a mainstream procedure in 2007. I think that anybody who has ever benefited from FUE should respect that.
Skywalker
Dr. Woods,
What is your position on placing body hair in the donor region, or “FIT Farming”, to fill in FUE extractions?
I wish I could completely share your views in BHT, however you are not completely correct. For some reason, maybe the local interleukins, cytokines, ect., in RARE patients; BHT has been seen to not only take on the characteristics of the area it was transplanted, i.e. caliber of the shafts, but more importantly, a definitive increase in length of the BHT’s. The length increase proved that BHT’s are capable of growing longer than its prior programmed length. These rare patients, are what I believe what drove the early proponets to continue push the research. There are just too many variables to know as to what is the perfect match in BHT. What made the few patients that had markedly great success over the one ones that lagged? Time, circulation, the BHT, genetics, circadian rhythms, technique, apoptosis, longer cycle time, oxidative stress growth retardation, luck of the draw???