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Taking Tocopherols & Tocotrienols separately


#1

http://www.needs.com/product/NDNL-0907-01/htc_Tocotrienols/?r=I07NDNL3RD

"However, what most companies don’t tell you is alpha-tocopherol interferes with the function of tocotrienol. For example, researchers concluded that effective tocotrienol preparations should contain less than 15% of alpha-tocopherol and more than 60% of delta- and gammatocotrienols. Total absence of alpha-tocopherol in the tocotrienol product would be optimal and should be taken at a separate time.

“A mix of both tocopherol forms of vitamin E (especially high gamma and alpha) and tocotrienols are beneficial to the human body. It is highly recommended to take a regimen of pure mixed tocopherols in the morning with your meal, and Annatto tocotrienol taken either at lunch or dinner with your meal. All vitamin E isomers are lipidsoluble supplements and are best taken with a meal, preferably dinner. Absorption is poor when these supplements are taken on an empty stomach.”

Notice the Carotech “study” was with just the tocotrienols(with small amounts of some other ingreds).

More info on that(pdf file) http://www.carotech.net/publish/image.htm?code=212


#2

» "However, what most companies don’t tell you is alpha-tocopherol
» interferes with the function of tocotrienol. For example, researchers
» concluded that effective tocotrienol preparations should contain less than
» 15% of alpha-tocopherol and more than 60% of delta- and gammatocotrienols.
» Total absence of alpha-tocopherol in the tocotrienol product would be
» optimal and should be taken at a separate time.
»
» “A mix of both tocopherol forms of vitamin E (especially high gamma and
» alpha) and tocotrienols are beneficial to the human body. It is highly
» recommended to take a regimen of pure mixed tocopherols in the morning with
» your meal, and Annatto tocotrienol taken either at lunch or dinner with
» your meal. All vitamin E isomers are lipidsoluble supplements and are best
» taken with a meal, preferably dinner. Absorption is poor when these
» supplements are taken on an empty stomach.”
»
» Notice the Carotech “study” was with just the tocotrienols(with small
» amounts of some other ingreds).

I wonder who the “researchers” were?

I am not sure that it’s necessary to supplement one’s diet with tocopherols, are you? RDA of vitamin E is around 15 mg. per day, and that’s relatively easy to obtain from a variety of sources (e.g. cereal, nuts, vegetables).


#3

»
»
» I wonder who the “researchers” were?
»
» I am not sure that it’s necessary to supplement one’s diet with
» tocopherols, are you? RDA of vitamin E is around 15 mg. per day, and
» that’s relatively easy to obtain from a variety of sources (e.g. cereal,
» nuts, vegetables).

The “researchers” for the taking them separately deal? I’m sure it’s out there somewhere…will have more time this weekend to look into it if no-one else does.

It’s probably not necessary to supplement the diet with the tocopherols…which makes Toco-8 kind of…ah…reduntant…not needed…what’s the word/phrase I’m looking for…


#4

Redundant… :lol2:

I’m asking around for this “research” for now…like from these guys: http://acgrace.com/tocotrienols.html

There might be something here too: http://www.tocotrienol.org


#5

"One might expect that in nature we would find the complete vitamin E family of tocopherols and tocotrienols together in various plants, especially since some companies produce vitamin E supplements that contain both the tocopherols and tocotrienols. Nothing could be further from the truth. The fact is, plants widely differ in their vitamin E proportions, and no single plant provides the entire vitamin E family in nutritionally adequate amounts. Annatto beans, for instance, are higher in tocotrienols but contain no tocopherols. Sunflower, peanut, walnut, sesame and olive oils contain significant amounts of the tocopherols, yet are virtually void of the tocotrienols.6

Even within the categories of plants that predominate in either tocopherols or tocotrienols, we find large variances in their specific alpha, beta, gamma, and delta proportions. For example, annatto is high in delta tocotrienol with moderate amounts of gamma tocotrienol. In oat and barley, alpha tocotrienol predominates. In hulled and de-hulled wheat, beta-tocotrienol is the predominate isomer.7

Thus, while tocopherols and tocotrienols both exist in nature, plants differ widely in their vitamin E proportions. This little-known fact radically changes the way we look at “naturally occurring” vitamin E and has important implications in vitamin E supplementation.

Companies that seek to provide the entire vitamin E family in one product derive the tocopherols and tocotrienols from separate plant sources (a review of the ingredient label should confirm this). Such products are typically developed by processing the tocotrienols (usually from palm or rice bran) into the tocopherols (usually from soy). While there are a few products that do provide the full range of tocopherols and tocotrienols without using separate sources, they provide only trivial amounts of portions of the vitamin E complex and are unable to deliver dose-dependant benefits such as the inhibition of c-reactive protein, a potent bio marker and mediator of Cardiovascular Disease.8 "

http://acgrace.com/what-are-tocotrienols.html

On that same page:

“Tocopherols, mainly alpha tocopherol, hinder the assimilation of tocotrienols in the human body.9 This is due to the preferential uptake of tocopherol via the tocopherol-transfer protein,10 which discriminates between tocopherols and tocotrienols.11 Thus, combining tocotrienols and tocopherols together does not appear to be efficacious.”

Which brings you to:

9 Packer L, Weber SU, Rimbach G. J Nutr. 2001 Feb; 131(2):369S-73S. Molecular aspects of alpha-tocotrienol antioxidant action and cell signalling.

10 Arita M., Sato Y., Miyata A., Tanabe T., Takahashi E., Kayden H. J., Arai H., Inoue K. Biochem. J. 1995;306:437-443. Human alpha-tocopherol transfer protein: cDNA cloning, expression and chromosomal localization.

11 Packer L, Weber SU, Rimbach G. J Nutr. 2001 Feb;131(2):369S-73S. Molecular aspects of alpha-tocotrienol antioxidant action and cell signalling.


#6

Are you referring to this Toco-8, "For instance, the National Academy of Sciences recently announced that supplementing with alpha-tocopherol alone depletes the body of the other members of the Vitamin E family. This is a problem because it is the “other” Vitamin E’s that show the most impressive benefits for improving cardiovascular health and hair regrowth.

Most alarming, is that tocotrienols are already extremely low in Western diets, while being simultaneously depleted by the ever dominating alpha-tocopherol supplementation! Tocotrienols should be first on your list of supplements."

I agree that it should at least be in everyone’s Top 3, whether your source is Jarrow’s, LEF’s, or Primordial Performance. But I believe Toco-8 to be the “fresher” of the three. My energy levels have noticeably spiked since using it. My hair? I don’t know if it’s the Toco-8, MSM, or both that I am taking but something is definitely thickening things up there.


#7

» Are you referring to this Toco-8, “For instance, the National Academy of
» Sciences recently announced that supplementing with alpha-tocopherol alone
» depletes the body of the other members of the Vitamin E family. This is a
» problem because it is the “other” Vitamin E’s that show the most impressive
» benefits for improving cardiovascular health and hair regrowth.
»
» Most alarming, is that tocotrienols are already extremely low in
» Western diets
, while being simultaneously depleted by the ever
» dominating alpha-tocopherol supplementation! Tocotrienols should be first
» on your list of supplements.”
»
» I agree that it should at least be in everyone’s Top 3, whether your
» source is Jarrow’s, LEF’s, or Primordial Performance. But I believe Toco-8
» to be the “fresher” of the three. My energy levels have noticeably spiked
» since using it. My hair? I don’t know if it’s the Toco-8, MSM, or both
» that I am taking but something is definitely thickening things up
» there.

Yep…Toco-8…and it relates to what you quoted there. Toco-8 contains all 8…including those tocopherols. There are a # of products that just contain the tocotrienols(including the Carotech one that also has a hair study). So if you can purchase/take them separately, like it seems is best to do…

BTW…I started a thread at HLF on liposomal supplement- what would you include. I started out with the 3 you’ve been mentioning, since they’ve been talked about so much everywhere. Maybe biotin(Hangin’? :lol2: ) Feel free to add to it there or here.


#8

» Redundant… :lol2:
»
» I’m asking around for this “research” for now…like from these guys:
» http://acgrace.com/tocotrienols.html
»
» There might be something here too: http://www.tocotrienol.org

Got some from the ACGrace folks…

I’ve uploaded a couple of PDF’s - “a couple of the papers that show that alpha-tocopherol attenuates (weakens) tocotrienol benefits, and another paper that show alpha-tocopherol to increase degradation of tocotrienols.”

They can be seen under “latest files” here: http://my.hairlossfight.com/


#9

Interesting material, Jacob. “…low of a-tocopherol concentration were consistently effective in both cholesterol (Khor et al. 1995, Qureshi et al. 1991a, 199 Ib, and 1995) and tumor (Tan 1992) studies.”

I did find this on the Primordial Performance forum, from a poster named Eric, who is apparently its founder:

“It is correct that if you supplement with additional alpha-tocopherol you may mitigate these benefits, but the amount naturally present in the Toco-8 is not enough to interfere with the benefits from the tocotrienols.”


#10

» Interesting material, Jacob. “…low of a-tocopherol concentration were
» consistently effective in both cholesterol (Khor et al. 1995, Qureshi et
» al. 1991a, 199 Ib, and 1995) and tumor (Tan 1992) studies.”
»
» I did find this on the Primordial Performance forum, from a poster named
» Eric, who is apparently its founder:
»
» “It is correct that if you supplement with additional alpha-tocopherol you
» may mitigate these benefits, but the amount naturally present in the Toco-8
» is not enough to interfere with the benefits from the tocotrienols.”

Oh sure…where’s HIS research :wink:

I’m sticking with just the tocotrienols…if I go that route.

ACGrace also has it in liquid form…meaning no gelcaps: http://acgrace.com/mixed-tocopherols-oil.html


#11

» Oh sure…where’s HIS research :wink:

LOL. I do wonder why other companies like Jarrow wouldn’t also be wary of making a product with both, tocotrienols and tocopherols, given the available research.

The mere presence of a tocopherol, in and of itself, is not enough to negate the benefits of the tocotrienols. It depends on the amount of tocopherol present.

Still, with an all-tocotrienol supplement, you wouldn’t even have to worry about the possibility of such (negating the benefits). That is why I am tempted to try this product out.

Another good find Jacob.


#12

I forgot to mention…as it says…that the liquid is a mixed toco product.