Roger_that you said that it\'s hard to inject cells into follicles

Stem cell; cell based hair therapy
21

I’ll tell you what is truly insane. What is truly insane is that you want your hair back and yet you attack one of the investigators who is investigating the most advanced techniques to regrow hair. What you’re doing is called biting the hand that feeds you and that’s pretty insane.

And Dr. Nigam is definitely adding his own ideas to the mix.

[quote]Lindo, you do not know for sure what the outcome of Hairlife’s procedure. We need to wait to find out. Also, Dr. Nigam is moving the ball much faster than the other hair loss researchers. And the people he does these treatments on want the treatment. If we wait for other researchers it will take years long. Dr. Nigam covers as much ground in 6 months as the other researchers cover in 5 - 10 years.
[postedby]Originally Posted by jarjarbinx[/postedby]

[postedby]Originally Posted by Lindo[/postedby]

Nobody knows what the outcome will be !! But without a way to guide the hair, ALL literature reports that cysts will form, even Jahoda reported that in his breakthrough. And that Dr Nigam is moving the ball faster, that’s just BS. He’s just throwing everything that REAL researchers invented, at patients. I wouldn’t call that research. It’s an insane method of trying everything out there, totally ignoring and disrespecting patient health implications.[/quote]

22

[quote]What’s insane is that you want your hair back and yet you attack one of the investigators who is trying to most advanced techniques to regrow hair. That’s insane. What you’re doing is called biting the hand that feeds you.

[postedby]Originally Posted by jarjarbinx[/postedby][/quote]

Haha feeding me ? What did Nigam feed us ? What did he invent ? What did he add to current knowledge ? Right. NOTHING. In the last 3 years we’ve seen enormous breakthroughs in the field. Teams from all over the world, Tokyo, china, Europe, America, are booking great progress. THAT’s what’s making the difference. The fact that dr Nigam is just throwing some random meds and stuff at paying patients, how does that benefit anyone but him self ?

23

What he’s doing helps us because he’s putting the ideas of other researchers into human trials so to speak. And he’s adding his own ideas into the mix. Other researchers are not doing human studies yet and they won’t be doing human studies for probably another 5 years or even longer. Dr. Nigam is doing it now. This helps us because thanks to Dr. Nigam the ball is advancing further and faster than it would without him.

Do you want your hair back in your lifetime or not?

If the things he’s doing result in major hair growth consistently in humans then he will be the most important baldness researcher in history, and he will be the man all the other researchers want to talk with. Gerd, Jahoda, Christiano, Tokyo, China, and maybe even Cots will all want to bask in his success and glory.

[quote]What’s insane is that you want your hair back and yet you attack one of the investigators who is trying to most advanced techniques to regrow hair. That’s insane. What you’re doing is called biting the hand that feeds you.

[postedby]Originally Posted by jarjarbinx[/postedby]

[postedby]Originally Posted by Lindo[/postedby]

Haha feeding me ? What did Nigam feed us ? What did he invent ? What did he add to current knowledge ? Right. NOTHING. In the last 3 years we’ve seen enormous breakthroughs in the field. Teams from all over the world, Tokyo, china, Europe, America, are booking great progress. THAT’s what’s making the difference. The fact that dr Nigam is just throwing some random meds and stuff at paying patient, how does that benefit anyone but him self ?[/quote]

24

Give me a break, man. You talk about cancer and health risk as if someone has died because of Dr. Nigam’s investigations. Give me a break please!!! We are talking about a complicated space-age hair transplant here man; we are not talking about open-heart surgery.

In a nutshell, Dr. Nigam is harvesting hair cells from the patient’s donor region and transplanting patient’s hair cells back into their recipient areas. Yes he’s culturing them first but cell culturing has been going on for almost 100 years. And again, we are talking about hair cells. Please!!! Stop the bs and please stop with the “The Sky Is Falling” drama. This drama is not necessary in this situation.

And you keep screaming cancer but thus far there is not one reported case of cancer stemming from Dr. Nigam’s investigations so please stop the histrionics.

[quote]The big money will return in numerous years. Right now baldness research is being advanced by the small researchers. That means we can’t afford to have any of the small researchers walk away from their research. None.

Given the above, it’s amazing that we have guys so stupid that they post personal and racist attacks against a small baldness researcher at a hair website. It’s even more amazing that the moderator of that hair website allows the posters to post those personal/racist attacks against a small baldness researcher. This behavior really is the definition of the word stupidity.

[postedby]Originally Posted by cal[/postedby]
The big money will return to the HM race when the small-time researchers come up with enough evidence that there is something that has a decent chance of panning out.

[postedby]Originally Posted by jarjarbinx[/postedby]

[postedby]Originally Posted by Lindo[/postedby]

Look at this guy ‘hairlife’ who played Nigam’s most recent guinea pig. Nigam didn’t use Nylon thread to guide the infundibulum direction, like Tsuji lab did, but followed Jahoda’s method. This WILL cause (if succesful at all) cysts to form, just like happened in Jahoda’s experiments. Hence this guy might need extended surgery to operate on his recipient, to remove all cysts, which might mess up his whole scalp ! And hairs that will be formed (if any at all) most likely will be deformed hair that will look really crazy, wrong thickness and colour and angle. And then there’s the real chance of cells going cancerous, Jahoda even warned for that. And then to think Nigam charges money for his experiments !! This guy should STOP experimenting on people, let alone charge money for it. If anything, he should pay his guinea pigs. If he wants to do real research, then do it like the pro’s and test it on human foreskin on SCID mice. But to do it on PAYING customers, that’s not just unethical, that’s outright bizarre.

Tons of research is being conducted by the REAL professionals right now. Leave it up to them, we don’t need any “Dr Nigam” who doesn’t have a clue, to perform dr Mengele-like experiments.[/quote]

25

And what’s the use of that ? Human skin on SCID mouse is a VERY accurate model. There’s no real advantage of testing it on real people, but there are tons of dangers for these patients, like cancer.

Oh really ! Then it must be easy for you to name one. Name just one please !

BS. He’s just riding the road that other, REAL, researchers paved for him. If he has success at some points, that’s only because he’s trying to replicate what other scientists invented, or suggested.

26

[quote]Give me a break, man. You talk about cancer and health risk as if someone has died because of Dr. Nigam’s investigations. Give me a break please!!! We are talking about a complicated space-age hair transplant here man; we are not talking about open-heart surgery.

In a nutshell, Dr. Nigam is harvesting hair cells from the patient’s donor region and transplanting patient’s hair cells back into their recipient areas. Yes he’s culturing them first but cell culturing has been going on for almost 100 years. And again, we are talking about hair cells. Please!!! Stop the bs and please stop with the “The Sky Is Falling” drama. This drama is not necessary in this situation.

And you keep screaming cancer but thus far there is not one reported case of cancer stemming from Dr. Nigam’s investigations so please stop the histrionics.
[postedby]Originally Posted by jarjarbinx[/postedby][/quote]

The problem with you JarJarbinx, is that you’re not only stupid but you’re totally clueless as well. Even jahoda hinted at the possibility of those cells going cancerous. And yet, here comes jarjarbinx, claiming that everything will be fine because “patients own cells are being used” and “it are just hair cells” and those can’t be cancerous. Sigh …

27

Where is even one case of these cells causing cancer? Is there even one case? No.

Researchers have to hint at things like the potential for cancer but that doesn’t mean they necessarily believe it. In this case, I do not believe Jahoda truly believe that this method of hair growth will cause cancer. Jahoda injected hair cells into himself and his own wife. He does not believe that these cells will cause cancer.

Keep in mind that Aderans and Replicel have also been injecting hair cells for years with no dangerous side effects, including no cancers.

You’re an idiot who’s needlessly trying to put a stop to the very research that could get you what you want. What a moron.

[quote]Give me a break, man. You talk about cancer and health risk as if someone has died because of Dr. Nigam’s investigations. Give me a break please!!! We are talking about a complicated space-age hair transplant here man; we are not talking about open-heart surgery.

In a nutshell, Dr. Nigam is harvesting hair cells from the patient’s donor region and transplanting patient’s hair cells back into their recipient areas. Yes he’s culturing them first but cell culturing has been going on for almost 100 years. And again, we are talking about hair cells. Please!!! Stop the bs and please stop with the “The Sky Is Falling” drama. This drama is not necessary in this situation.

And you keep screaming cancer but thus far there is not one reported case of cancer stemming from Dr. Nigam’s investigations so please stop the histrionics.
[postedby]Originally Posted by jarjarbinx[/postedby]

[postedby]Originally Posted by Lindo[/postedby]

The problem with you JarJarbinx, is that you’re not only stupid but you’re totally clueless as well. Even jahoda hinted at the possibility of those cells going cancerous. And yet, here comes jarjarbinx, claiming that everything will be fine because “patients own cells are being used” and those can’t be cancerous. Sigh …[/quote]

28

[quote]But where is the case of these cells causing cancer? Is there even one case? No.

[postedby]Originally Posted by jarjarbinx[/postedby][/quote]

Exactly, and that’s why clinical trials are needed, to judge safety. Nigam is just injecting it right away into patients, while the REAL researchers like Jahoda hinted that safety is a concern.

29

[quote]
Keep in mind that Aderans and Replicel have also been injecting hair cells for years with no dangerous side effects, including no cancers.

[postedby]Originally Posted by jarjarbinx[/postedby][/quote]

Man. Really, I mean this. Reading your posts and all the stupidity you put into them makes me want to stick a fork in my eye and twist it. I can’t handle your stupidity anymore. Please go away, stop posting remarks like thise. What do Aderan’s and Replicel’s trials have to do with Jahoda’s research (which Nigam is trying to exploit) ?

30

Jahoda injected these cells into himself and his wife. He does not really believe that there’s a significant threat of cancer.

Again, Replicel and Aderans have injected hair cells into hundreds of human patients with no dangerous side effects, especially no cancers. Not one case of cancer. You are way over-reacting.

[quote]But where is the case of these cells causing cancer? Is there even one case? No.

[postedby]Originally Posted by jarjarbinx[/postedby]

[postedby]Originally Posted by Lindo[/postedby]

Exactly, and that’s why clinical trials are needed, to judge safety. Nigam is just injecting it right away into patients, while the REAL researchers like Jahoda hinted that safety is a concern.[/quote]

31

[quote]Jahoda injected these cells into himself and his wife. He does not really believe that there’s a significant threat of cancer.
[postedby]Originally Posted by jarjarbinx[/postedby][/quote]

Oh really !! Please link us to the source of your info that states that Jahoda injected CULTURED DP cells into his own arm. Thanks !

32

And Dr. Nigam has also injected a lot of patients with these cells with not one reported case of cancer. Please stop the histrionics.

[quote]Jahoda injected these cells into himself and his wife. He does not really believe that there’s a significant threat of cancer.
[postedby]Originally Posted by jarjarbinx[/postedby]

[postedby]Originally Posted by Lindo[/postedby]

Oh really !! Please link us to the source of your info that states that Jahoda injected CULTURED DP cells into his own arm. Thanks ![/quote]

33

Chicken Little, please stop screaming about cancer and show me even one real-time, real-life case of cancer caused by these cells.

[quote]Give me a break, man. You talk about cancer and health risk as if someone has died because of Dr. Nigam’s investigations. Give me a break please!!! We are talking about a complicated space-age hair transplant here man; we are not talking about open-heart surgery.

In a nutshell, Dr. Nigam is harvesting hair cells from the patient’s donor region and transplanting patient’s hair cells back into their recipient areas. Yes he’s culturing them first but cell culturing has been going on for almost 100 years. And again, we are talking about hair cells. Please!!! Stop the bs and please stop with the “The Sky Is Falling” drama. This drama is not necessary in this situation.

And you keep screaming cancer but thus far there is not one reported case of cancer stemming from Dr. Nigam’s investigations so please stop the histrionics.
[postedby]Originally Posted by jarjarbinx[/postedby]

[postedby]Originally Posted by Lindo[/postedby]

The problem with you JarJarbinx, is that you’re not only stupid but you’re totally clueless as well. Even jahoda hinted at the possibility of those cells going cancerous. And yet, here comes jarjarbinx, claiming that everything will be fine because “patients own cells are being used” and “it are just hair cells” and those can’t be cancerous. Sigh …[/quote]

34

I think you should do it. Go ahead, stick a fork in your eye and twist it. That’s the only way to stop me from posting my stupid posts. LOL!!

You talk about sticking a fork in YOUR eye and twisting it because MY posts are stupid and you think you’re smart. Open up your eyes man, you’re not as smart as you think you are.

[quote]
Keep in mind that Aderans and Replicel have also been injecting hair cells for years with no dangerous side effects, including no cancers.

[postedby]Originally Posted by jarjarbinx[/postedby]

[postedby]Originally Posted by Lindo[/postedby]

Man. Really, I mean this. Reading your posts and all the stupidity you put into them makes me want to stick a fork in my eye and twist it. I can’t handle your stupidity anymore. Please go away, stop posting remarks like thise. What do Aderan’s and Replicel’s trials have to do with Jahoda’s research (which Nigam is trying to exploit) ?[/quote]

35

[quote]Chicken Little, please stop screaming about cancer and show me even one real-time, real-life case of cancer caused by these cells.
[postedby]Originally Posted by jarjarbinx[/postedby][/quote]

Sigh… Discussion with you is so hard cause you’re just so stupid. As we both agreed, there are no tests on humans, only on SCID mice bearing human skin (which serves as a very good model). Only Nigam injected cultured DP cells into humans, but he’s constantly changing protocols and he’s only been doing it for a very short while, so there’s absolutely no result as towards cancer activity. You know how in clinical trials experimenting with stem cells they follow patients up to 15 years ?

But this is exactly why NORMAL doctors have to obey by clinical trials, cause it’s risky. Jahoda warned of cancer. You can try to twist it as you want but if you’re so certain this is safe, then why dont you neglect what the REAL researchers are saying and offer Nigam to run his next experiments on you ! And your arguments that it’s safe because it are ‘patient own cells’ and ‘just hair cells’ is possibly the most stupid thing you’ve ever said. And trust me, that’s an accomplishment.

36

Thanks for telling me your opinion about what is the stupidest argument ever presented. I have my own opinion about what the most stupidest argument ever presented is. I think the stupidest argument ever presented is your argument that you are so smart that you are going to stick a fork in your eye and twist it to get me to take the stupid out of my posts. LOL!

What you decry as his “constantly changing protocols” is actually him conducting many different experiments. He’s trying to find a protocol that produces breakthrough results. He’s not doing one study with many different protocols; he’s doing many studies with one subject in each study. He continually tweaks the protocol & continually starts new studies in the hopes of finding the protocol that produces breakthrough results. It’s like he’s put experimentation into fast-forward.

I’ve said repeatedly I’m not going to India unless/until he finds a breakthrough protocol. I’ve told you this at least a dozen times. An Alzheimer’s patient would have it memorized by now. Please stop asking me to go to India for Dr. Nigam’s treatment unless/until he finds a breakthrough treatment? He’s regrowing some hair but not enough.

And if these cells can grow hair then sooner or later they’re going to have to implant them into humans so Dr. Nigam might as well hit the fast-forward button & do it now.

And now you are talking about waiting 15 years to see if these cells cause cancer. If you want to wait 15 years you can, but some of us don’t want to wait 15 years. Do those of us who want treatment sooner have the right to get to skip your self-imposed 15-year wait if we want to or you dictating a 15-year wait on the rest of us?

Dr. Nigam doesn’t have any prisoner-patients. You’re being dishonest and slanderous when you compare Dr. Nigam to Joseph Mengele. Dr. Nigam is conducting these studies on free people who want to try these treatments now rather than waiting 15 years despite your dictate to these people that they must wait 15 years. I know what these people are thinking because I’m thinking the same way. If and when Dr. Nigam finds a consistent breakthrough protocol then I’m flying to India for treatment. I’m not a prisoner. I would making this choice of my own free will just like his present customers.

I do think you’re trying to help but you’re not being honest even with yourself.

[quote]Chicken Little, please stop screaming about cancer and show me even one real-time, real-life case of cancer caused by these cells.
[postedby]Originally Posted by jarjarbinx[/postedby]

[postedby]Originally Posted by Lindo[/postedby]

Sigh… Discussion with you is so hard cause you’re just so stupid. As we both agreed, there are no tests on humans, only on SCID mice bearing human skin (which serves as a very good model). Only Nigam injected cultured DP cells into humans, but he’s constantly changing protocols and he’s only been doing it for a very short while, so there’s absolutely no result as towards cancer activity. You know how in clinical trials experimenting with stem cells they follow patients up to 15 years ?

But this is exactly why NORMAL doctors have to obey by clinical trials, cause it’s risky. Jahoda warned of cancer. You can try to twist it as you want but if you’re so certain this is safe, then why dont you neglect what the REAL researchers are saying and offer Nigam to run his next experiments on you ! And your arguments that it’s safe because it are ‘patient own cells’ and ‘just hair cells’ is possibly the most stupid thing you’ve ever said. And trust me, that’s an accomplishment.[/quote]

37

Do you know how many products out there have a potential cancer risk? Almost everything out there has some cancer risk. Did you know minoxidil has a cancer risk? I think milk even has a cancer risk.

You point out how some cancers don’t show up until 15 years after exposure. Your point is that we should wait until 15 years after the first DP cell human experiment before we get the treatment even if the treatment is shown to work within the next year. Give me a break. If the treatment works then you’ll be waiting for 15 years by yourself. Everyone else is going to get the treatment if it works.

About this issue you raise that it can take 15 years after exposure to a carcinogen for cancer to show, I would like to point something out. What you are saying is that even after a treatment has successfully gone through phase 1, phase 2, phase 3 studies, and been FDA-approved, people still shouldn’t take the medicine because those studies and approval takes about 7 years so it will be 8 more years before we know if it’s really safe or not. Do you understand that, that is your point? Do you understand that what you are saying is that after FDA-approval we should still not take a medicine for about another 8 years because there is a chance that the medicine could cause cancer but the FDA studies weren’t long enough to really determine if the medicine can cause cancer. Do you realize how stupid your argument is, especially considering that, like I said at the top of this very post, almost everything can cause cancer. The plastic we all handle at times in the day can cause cancer. Did you know that? WTF? In the right concentrations almost everything on our planet can cancer in some percentage of people over enough time.

I’m not scared that these cells will cause cancer. I don’t buy it. I’m only waiting for a breakthrough protocol.

[quote]Chicken Little, please stop screaming about cancer and show me even one real-time, real-life case of cancer caused by these cells.
[postedby]Originally Posted by jarjarbinx[/postedby]

[postedby]Originally Posted by Lindo[/postedby]

Sigh… Discussion with you is so hard cause you’re just so stupid. As we both agreed, there are no tests on humans, only on SCID mice bearing human skin (which serves as a very good model). Only Nigam injected cultured DP cells into humans, but he’s constantly changing protocols and he’s only been doing it for a very short while, so there’s absolutely no result as towards cancer activity. You know how in clinical trials experimenting with stem cells they follow patients up to 15 years ?

But this is exactly why NORMAL doctors have to obey by clinical trials, cause it’s risky. Jahoda warned of cancer. You can try to twist it as you want but if you’re so certain this is safe, then why dont you neglect what the REAL researchers are saying and offer Nigam to run his next experiments on you ! And your arguments that it’s safe because it are ‘patient own cells’ and ‘just hair cells’ is possibly the most stupid thing you’ve ever said. And trust me, that’s an accomplishment.[/quote]

38

[quote] exposure. Your point is that we should wait until 15 years after the first DP cell human experiment before we get the treatment even if the treatment is shown to work within the next year.
[postedby]Originally Posted by jarjarbinx[/postedby][/quote]

That’s not my point at all. My point is that first more preclinical research is needed, just like Jahoda noted. Jahoda said they were confident to go into clinical trials within a few years. That gives them time to optimize their procedure, see if there are preclinical health risks and after that they can in a structured manner evaluate safety in clinical human trials. Exactly how the process normally goes.

I don’t have a problem with people wanting to take risks. If they’re so depressed with their hairloss that they’re fine with a risk to get cancer, they should perfectly be allowed to take that risk in my opinion. I’m a libertarian. In my opinion people should just be informed about the risks, that’s all, and you telling people that it’s perfectly safe, while it’s not, that’s not helping anyone at all.

If people understand the risks and are willing to take them, be my guest.

39

[quote] exposure. Your point is that we should wait until 15 years after the first DP cell human experiment before we get the treatment even if the treatment is shown to work within the next year.
[postedby]Originally Posted by jarjarbinx[/postedby]

[postedby]Originally Posted by Lindo[/postedby]

That’s not my point at all. My point is that first more preclinical research is needed, just like Jahoda noted. Jahoda said they were confident to go into clinical trials within a few years. That gives them time to optimize their procedure, see if there are preclinical health risks and after that they can in a structured manner evaluate safety in clinical human trials. Exactly how the process normally goes.

I don’t have a problem with people wanting to take risks. If they’re so depressed with their hairloss that they’re fine with a risk to get cancer, they should perfectly be allowed to take that risk in my opinion. I’m a libertarian. In my opinion people should just be informed about the risks, that’s all, and you telling people that it’s perfectly safe, while it’s not, that’s not helping anyone at all.

If people understand the risks and are willing to take them, be my guest.[/quote]

Right now we don’t know for certain that cultured DP cells would cause cancer in even one person. But let’s pretend it’s a known fact that it would cause cancer in 1 out of 10,000 people, and let’s also pretend that it would reverse hair loss back to NW1 or at least NW2 and full thickness in thinning areas. I would take the risk. I would also reduce my chances of getting cancer in every other way imaginable to try to offset the fact that I was exposing myself to a cancer risk. For example, I would eat right, get plenty of sleep, etc, etc, etc. If there are cancer prevention drugs I might even consider getting on one. So even if I knew there was a cancer risk I would still do it if it would produce breakthrough results.

Keep in mind that like I said, almost everything is linked to cancer. Milk is linked to cancer, red meat is linked to cancer, minoxidil is linked to tumors, spironolactone is linked to tumors, handling plastic can cause cancer, the sun can cause cancer, etc, etc, etc.

Right now, I’m just waiting to see if Dr. Nigam can get the door unlocked and consistently achieve breakthrough results. As soon as i see that then I’ll go through the burden of going to India 4 - 5 times in order to get the treatments. But I don’t want to go through the burden of going there 4 - 5 times to get back a little hair.

I’m a NW3 with thinning across the top and a spot on the crown. I’m not going to India 4 - 5 times just to end up a NW3 with a little less thinning on the top.

If I lived in India I would be tempted to get the treatment since he has now started the 3d spheroids. He is really looking at some interesting ways to tweak things.

Lindo, if Dr. Nigam starts getting consistent breakthrough results I’ll go before you and I’ll work with you guys here to make sure that my treatments will be set up in such a way that my results will be unquestionable. Anything reasonable you guys ask me to do I’ll do, as long as it doesn’t cost a bunch of money or be some huge laborious effort. And I won’t charge you guys one cent to share my treatment process, including independent hair counts, if necessary.

40

[quote] exposure. Your point is that we should wait until 15 years after the first DP cell human experiment before we get the treatment even if the treatment is shown to work within the next year.
[postedby]Originally Posted by jarjarbinx[/postedby]

[postedby]Originally Posted by Lindo[/postedby]

That’s not my point at all. My point is that first more preclinical research is needed, just like Jahoda noted. Jahoda said they were confident to go into clinical trials within a few years. That gives them time to optimize their procedure, see if there are preclinical health risks and after that they can in a structured manner evaluate safety in clinical human trials. Exactly how the process normally goes.

I don’t have a problem with people wanting to take risks. If they’re so depressed with their hairloss that they’re fine with a risk to get cancer, they should perfectly be allowed to take that risk in my opinion. I’m a libertarian. In my opinion people should just be informed about the risks, that’s all, and you telling people that it’s perfectly safe, while it’s not, that’s not helping anyone at all.

If people understand the risks and are willing to take them, be my guest.[/quote]

so then you yourself admit that Jahoda is saying that it will be a few more years before they will even start clinical trials, and then you can add 5 - 6 years on top of that until the treatment gets through clinical trials, so you are looking at 7 - 10 years if we wait for Jahoda.

How many youths do you get Lindo? Did you find a way to get to do your 20s and 30s four or five times? You only get to have one youth Lindo.