Follica home experiment update

[mikewalters]

» I see the hairs you are referring to. Can you take a photo of the other
» temple so we can compare?

Too late, I gave the camera back. What I can tell you is that the other temple has no growth on the bald area but there are activity in terms of growth within the hairline on the side. I wounded about an inch in on both sides on where my original hairline is now. My only guess is that the single layer peel was not good enough to to get brand new growth where there were none b4 but it can help rejuvenate oldies that are going dormant. Look at what happened with baccy, with the sporadic growth all over the top but nothing on the temples. This exactly what I mean When I say I got something started but the quality is not there.

[mikewalters]

» » » Ok, I got my hands briefly on a cheap camera and it doesn’t do it
» » justice.
» » » I’m no expert in photography. You guys can use this as future
» reference
» » if
» » » it progresses. Here is a close up shot with the macro mode. The
» flash
» » is
» » » interfering a little. You can still see a little damage from the the
» » peel.
» » » If you’re wondering, these weren’t there
» » » b4.

» » » Crap, this is difficult. I’m trying to get a bigger close up here as
» » it
» » » is not showing well. U might have to save to ur desktop at enlarge
» » » manually as there tons more that are lighter in color that doesn’t
» show
» » up.
» » » Ok, this is edit. You’re seeing the one’s that are starting to get
» » some
» » » pigmentation. I just got up and looked at the mirror at it at a side
» » angle
» » » and I can see tons of lighter hairs that doesn’t show up in the
» » picture,
» » » damn! I might have to wait for someone to help me with this.
» »
» » You know mikewaters,
» »
» »
» » Give those baby hairs time and at the end of the day , if nothing work
» for
» » them may be you should depilate them and do the follica procdedure again
» !
»
» It needs to be longer to do that, I’m trying for another shot while I
» still have the camera. Hold on.
»
»

If you look at this and thinking that it is longer near the hairline, you r right. I’ve always felt that if this would work, it would grow a whole patch equally at where I wounded. Although as a whole, all the hairs did get longer and more pigmented, it is coming out in a strange way. It seems to be going at a faster rate near my hairline and slower as you go down. It’s like a hiarachy effect or something, I can’t explain it but I have my gueses.

[forresthill]

» » » » Ok, I got my hands briefly on a cheap camera and it doesn’t do it
» » » justice.
» » » » I’m no expert in photography. You guys can use this as future
» » reference
» » » if
» » » » it progresses. Here is a close up shot with the macro mode. The
» » flash
» » » is
» » » » interfering a little. You can still see a little damage from the
» the
» » » peel.
» » » » If you’re wondering, these weren’t there
» » » » b4.

» » » » Crap, this is difficult. I’m trying to get a bigger close up here
» as
» » » it
» » » » is not showing well. U might have to save to ur desktop at enlarge
» » » » manually as there tons more that are lighter in color that doesn’t
» » show
» » » up.
» » » » Ok, this is edit. You’re seeing the one’s that are starting to
» get
» » » some
» » » » pigmentation. I just got up and looked at the mirror at it at a
» side
» » » angle
» » » » and I can see tons of lighter hairs that doesn’t show up in the
» » » picture,
» » » » damn! I might have to wait for someone to help me with this.
» » »
» » » You know mikewaters,
» » »
» » »
» » » Give those baby hairs time and at the end of the day , if nothing
» work
» » for
» » » them may be you should depilate them and do the follica procdedure
» again
» » !
» »
» » It needs to be longer to do that, I’m trying for another shot while I
» » still have the camera. Hold on.
» »
» »

»
» If you look at this and thinking that it is longer near the hairline, you
» r right. I’ve always felt that if this would work, it would grow a whole
» patch equally at where I wounded. Although as a whole, all the hairs did
» get longer and more pigmented, it is coming out in a strange way. It seems
» to be going at a faster rate near my hairline and slower as you go down.
» It’s like a hiarachy effect or something, I can’t explain it but I have my
» gueses.

I wonder if the depth of the wound has something to do with removing the collagen buildup in the area.

[mikewalters]

» » » » » Ok, I got my hands briefly on a cheap camera and it doesn’t do it
» » » » justice.
» » » » » I’m no expert in photography. You guys can use this as future
» » » reference
» » » » if
» » » » » it progresses. Here is a close up shot with the macro mode. The
» » » flash
» » » » is
» » » » » interfering a little. You can still see a little damage from the
» » the
» » » » peel.
» » » » » If you’re wondering, these weren’t there
» » » » » b4.

» » » » » Crap, this is difficult. I’m trying to get a bigger close up
» here
» » as
» » » » it
» » » » » is not showing well. U might have to save to ur desktop at
» enlarge
» » » » » manually as there tons more that are lighter in color that
» doesn’t
» » » show
» » » » up.
» » » » » Ok, this is edit. You’re seeing the one’s that are starting to
» » get
» » » » some
» » » » » pigmentation. I just got up and looked at the mirror at it at a
» » side
» » » » angle
» » » » » and I can see tons of lighter hairs that doesn’t show up in the
» » » » picture,
» » » » » damn! I might have to wait for someone to help me with this.
» » » »
» » » » You know mikewaters,
» » » »
» » » »
» » » » Give those baby hairs time and at the end of the day , if nothing
» » work
» » » for
» » » » them may be you should depilate them and do the follica procdedure
» » again
» » » !
» » »
» » » It needs to be longer to do that, I’m trying for another shot while I
» » » still have the camera. Hold on.
» » »
» » »

» »
» » If you look at this and thinking that it is longer near the hairline,
» you
» » r right. I’ve always felt that if this would work, it would grow a
» whole
» » patch equally at where I wounded. Although as a whole, all the hairs
» did
» » get longer and more pigmented, it is coming out in a strange way. It
» seems
» » to be going at a faster rate near my hairline and slower as you go down.
»
» » It’s like a hiarachy effect or something, I can’t explain it but I have
» my
» » gueses.
»
»
» I wonder if the depth of the wound has something to do with removing the
» collagen buildup in the area.

Again, beyond my understanding. The color of my temples has been off for a while now after wounding. It is also noticeably shinier. I wonder if it will go away. I’m leaving them out of the sun as much as possible to avoid hyper-pigmentation. But look on the bright side, if it ever fills in then who cares what color they are right.

[coffee]

» Ok, I got my hands briefly on a cheap camera and it doesn’t do it justice.
» I’m no expert in photography.

It looks like you did a pretty good job on the photo. Getting a closeup picture like this that actually resolves hair, much less the new/rejuvenated ones we’re trying to photograph, isn’t easy.

Can you give us an idea how large the photographed area is? That is, about how wide was the field of view (just to give us an idea of what type of density you’re seeing here)?

Also, was uploading the images pretty straightforward (might try this at some point myself)?

thanks for the effort and all the great info.

[Baccy]

» » First, let me tell you that I appreciate your work and the work of your
» » friends, Not only me who’s appreciating but the whole board (except a
» » minority) and I think I can speak for them here.
» »
» » 1/I like you think that the topical pathway to EGF-R is probably better
» » than the oral one.
»
» I believe this this is the way. Taking getfitnib orally is insane imo.
» Although it will not kill you, look at the side effects it can cause. I
» can’t imagine this is the way to go unless you go at it with very low
» doses. Maybe you can split the pill into qaurters and take 62.5mg per day.
» But as you can see by the few that has done the the full 250mg route,
» there is nothing to report except bad side effects.
»
» » 2/Can you explain please, why do you think that the guy who’s trying in
» a
» » different board will fail ?
»
» I’ve done a single 30% tca peel on one of my temples with no results, he
» is doing a single 20% peel with topical getfitnib. He will see no results.
» On my other temple, I did layer after layer for a good 30 mins in the
» bathroom about 5 minutes apart waiting for the last layer to self
» neutralize. The burning sensation was a little uncomforatable but not
» unbearable. I applied, sat there and had a cigarette and drank beer to
» help me past the time between applications. The experience wasn’t that
» bad. That temple sprouted a very even coat of vellous hairs.
»
» » 3/Can you explain please what’s the message that you want us to relay
» it
» » over the regrowth board ?
»
» Just simply, his single 20% won’t do because someone here did that with no
» results. I’ve reading these boards for a while now and from my experience,
» it is deeper than most think to get anything going. You don’t go so deep
» where you can hurt yourself obviously
»
» » 4/What sizes of wound you suggest ? as you said that size is as
» important
» » as depth.
»
» I don’t know but but poking holes won’t get you anything significant.
» Maybe you can rejuvenate some old follicles doing this. I think baccy can
» attest to this with the area being important. I’m think about doing the
» whole scalp next, this should take care of the area. I’m considering doing
» a 25% tca peel 5x’s over the scalp on my next attempt. BTW, what I did
» last time did seem to bring back some of the old hairs at the hairline and
» they are growing. I went way below where my mature hairline should be.
» This is the area I’m talking about here with my wounding + getfitnib. I’ll
» take bringing back all the old follicles but I’m trying to grow new ones.
» In other words, I’m being greedy. I’ve had too bad years with a F@cked up
» hairline and think it’s time for payback.
»
» » 5/Are you aware that Cotsarelis pointed out in his papers that a
» » depilation of the hair pre-procedure’d bring an 11 tiems yield increase
» .
»
» I am aware of this, but there is nothing to depilate on my bald temples.
» If it is the quantity you’re worried about, you shouldn’t. Let me say
» again, my “new growth” temple is absolutely filled with vellous activity.
» I am impressed with what I see. What I don’t like is quality of it. It’s
» there and barely visible. It did grow a little and became slightly more
» pigmented since I first noticed it but that is about it for now. It has
» been a few months. Will it ever go full terminal? I have my doubts and is
» getting impatient.
»
»
» » 6/Are you aware of the Wnt effect on hair growth in the Follica
» procedure
» » ?
»
» I don’t know what you mean by this. As far as I know, upregulate the wnt
» protein and you get hair growth. I did not use lithium because it was not
» mentioned in the 2nd patent by who knows, it could still be in the mix with
» follica when they are all said and done. They still have the use of
» lithium covered in their first patent which I believe is still valid. I’m
» not a science guy, I’m just a regular schmoo like most of you guys here. I
» did the experiment and did the way I thought it should be done which is the
» topical route. Had I did just one or two layers of peeling and seen no
» results, I would have never posted here. I actually thought I was stupid
» to do that many peels on that one temple (maybe it was there beer that made
» me do it), but I no doubt see sprouts covering the whole area that seems
» like it would take 5 years to grow out to an inch. 5 layers of peel is a
» stupid thing to do, especially if you’ve never done this b4. But look at
» what I accidently stumbled across. I seriously think multi-layer peeling +
» topical getfitnib is the direction to go. I applied 24 hours post wounding
» for 2 weeks, maybe I should have waited or maybe I should have used lithium
» prior or during. Maybe I should have been on topical immunesuppressants
» during treatment to get better results. I don’t know. I kid you not that
» this caused sprouts. Perhaps some here can take this to the next level in
» terms of qaulity and growth.

Way to go Mike! You’ve actually inspired me to plan another attempt but using chemical peeling. I tried a mild glycolic peel in the past but it didn’t seem to have any effect so I wound up sanding over it. I think I’ll try a deep multiple peel using 30% TCA.

[mikewalters]

» » » First, let me tell you that I appreciate your work and the work of
» your
» » » friends, Not only me who’s appreciating but the whole board (except a
» » » minority) and I think I can speak for them here.
» » »
» » » 1/I like you think that the topical pathway to EGF-R is probably
» better
» » » than the oral one.
» »
» » I believe this this is the way. Taking getfitnib orally is insane imo.
»
» » Although it will not kill you, look at the side effects it can cause.
» I
» » can’t imagine this is the way to go unless you go at it with very low
» » doses. Maybe you can split the pill into qaurters and take 62.5mg per
» day.
» » But as you can see by the few that has done the the full 250mg route,
» » there is nothing to report except bad side effects.
» »
» » » 2/Can you explain please, why do you think that the guy who’s trying
» in
» » a
» » » different board will fail ?
» »
» » I’ve done a single 30% tca peel on one of my temples with no results,
» he
» » is doing a single 20% peel with topical getfitnib. He will see no
» results.
» » On my other temple, I did layer after layer for a good 30 mins in the
» » bathroom about 5 minutes apart waiting for the last layer to self
» » neutralize. The burning sensation was a little uncomforatable but not
» » unbearable. I applied, sat there and had a cigarette and drank beer to
» » help me past the time between applications. The experience wasn’t that
» » bad. That temple sprouted a very even coat of vellous hairs.
» »
» » » 3/Can you explain please what’s the message that you want us to relay
» » it
» » » over the regrowth board ?
» »
» » Just simply, his single 20% won’t do because someone here did that with
» no
» » results. I’ve reading these boards for a while now and from my
» experience,
» » it is deeper than most think to get anything going. You don’t go so
» deep
» » where you can hurt yourself obviously
» »
» » » 4/What sizes of wound you suggest ? as you said that size is as
» » important
» » » as depth.
» »
» » I don’t know but but poking holes won’t get you anything significant.
» » Maybe you can rejuvenate some old follicles doing this. I think baccy
» can
» » attest to this with the area being important. I’m think about doing
» the
» » whole scalp next, this should take care of the area. I’m considering
» doing
» » a 25% tca peel 5x’s over the scalp on my next attempt. BTW, what I did
» » last time did seem to bring back some of the old hairs at the hairline
» and
» » they are growing. I went way below where my mature hairline should be.
»
» » This is the area I’m talking about here with my wounding + getfitnib.
» I’ll
» » take bringing back all the old follicles but I’m trying to grow new
» ones.
» » In other words, I’m being greedy. I’ve had too bad years with a F@cked
» up
» » hairline and think it’s time for payback.
» »
» » » 5/Are you aware that Cotsarelis pointed out in his papers that a
» » » depilation of the hair pre-procedure’d bring an 11 tiems yield
» increase
» » .
» »
» » I am aware of this, but there is nothing to depilate on my bald temples.
»
» » If it is the quantity you’re worried about, you shouldn’t. Let me say
» » again, my “new growth” temple is absolutely filled with vellous
» activity.
» » I am impressed with what I see. What I don’t like is quality of it.
» It’s
» » there and barely visible. It did grow a little and became slightly
» more
» » pigmented since I first noticed it but that is about it for now. It
» has
» » been a few months. Will it ever go full terminal? I have my doubts and
» is
» » getting impatient.
» »
» »
» » » 6/Are you aware of the Wnt effect on hair growth in the Follica
» » procedure
» » » ?
» »
» » I don’t know what you mean by this. As far as I know, upregulate the
» wnt
» » protein and you get hair growth. I did not use lithium because it was
» not
» » mentioned in the 2nd patent by who knows, it could still be in the mix
» with
» » follica when they are all said and done. They still have the use of
» » lithium covered in their first patent which I believe is still valid.
» I’m
» » not a science guy, I’m just a regular schmoo like most of you guys here.
» I
» » did the experiment and did the way I thought it should be done which is
» the
» » topical route. Had I did just one or two layers of peeling and seen no
» » results, I would have never posted here. I actually thought I was
» stupid
» » to do that many peels on that one temple (maybe it was there beer that
» made
» » me do it), but I no doubt see sprouts covering the whole area that
» seems
» » like it would take 5 years to grow out to an inch. 5 layers of peel is
» a
» » stupid thing to do, especially if you’ve never done this b4. But look
» at
» » what I accidently stumbled across. I seriously think multi-layer
» peeling +
» » topical getfitnib is the direction to go. I applied 24 hours post
» wounding
» » for 2 weeks, maybe I should have waited or maybe I should have used
» lithium
» » prior or during. Maybe I should have been on topical
» immunesuppressants
» » during treatment to get better results. I don’t know. I kid you not
» that
» » this caused sprouts. Perhaps some here can take this to the next level
» in
» » terms of qaulity and growth.
»
»
» Way to go Mike! You’ve actually inspired me to plan another attempt but
» using chemical peeling. I tried a mild glycolic peel in the past but it
» didn’t seem to have any effect so I wound up sanding over it. I think I’ll
» try a deep multiple peel using 30% TCA.

Baccy, I tell you what. I will mix you up a batch of getfitnib and send it to you if you trust me. I am almost ready to say that I can see a light 5 o’clock shadow on my right temple and my left temple is just starting to bud. I’m pretty sure I’m getting back some oldies on top and most likely some new ones from what I can tell on my hairline. They are so short that it does not make a cosmetic difference in terms of volume to my diffuse top yet. But… I could be seeing things and I’m not positive of this, but my see thru scalp does look darker than I rememeber it b4. Again, don’t hold me on this one yet. Yes, the horse shoe hairline looks like it might make it back to full recovery. The good thing about it is that the way it coming out, it blends right in with my existing hairline. Did I mention b4 it is like an hiarchy effect if that is the correct way to discribe it. Hairs along the hairline are coming out faster than the new ones below it. The ones below it are “brand new” and yes I’m going for a straight across hair line. It is very weird. My temples are still red and inflamed btw. Oh, frankie b and myself no side effects whatsoever from this topically and I doubt you will also. What I can say is most of this is more than likely due to my first try on this without tacro ot anti-histimine. I used those 2 in conjunction the second time and I’m sure it has no visual impact yet because it is too early post 2nd experiment. If you are interested let me have your addy and I will work with you on this one. It looks loke most here will believe what you say. You need to use getfitnib. Again, I gain nothing from this.

[mikewalters]

My only guess is that I was maybe too early (24 hours) when I started getfitnib applications or I needed to up wnt in some way during treatment to accelerate things. My other explaination for the slow progress is that this is how fast it works in humans… period. I have no shedding these days at all. I may loose a few hairs during washing but that is it. If I have to guess, I would say it would be march 2009 b4 I see some obvious improvements.

[dave21]

Mikewalters, that’s absolutely amazing. You and Baccy are so extremely important to this forum and everyone else. If you are able to take some pictures please do!

[HMorHT]

» My only guess is that I was maybe too early (24 hours) when I started
» getfitnib applications or I needed to up wnt in some way during treatment
» to accelerate things. My other explaination for the slow progress is that
» this is how fast it works in humans… period. I have no shedding these
» days at all. I may loose a few hairs during washing but that is it. If I
» have to guess, I would say it would be march 2009 b4 I see some obvious
» improvements.

Please please please take some before and after photos

[mikewalters]

» Mikewalters, that’s absolutely amazing. You and Baccy are so extremely
» important to this forum and everyone else. If you are able to take some
» pictures please do!

I don’t care about being important, I just want this to work and get a good healthy noggin’ again, that is all. I still find it frustrating how I kind of got it to work somewhat topically and baccy got it to work topically (but I considered his results mostly rejuvenated hairs) yet most here are still looking to ingest these drugs. If no one else wants to do it topically (maybe a little differently in timing or such), then everyone will have to wait to see if things further improves. Let me tell you, that 1st experiment did do something to my wounded areas in the positive direction. I don’t have too much to say about it that I haven’t already said. Right now, it is the waiting game for me and the follicles – new and old.

[Baccy]

»
» Baccy, I tell you what. I will mix you up a batch of getfitnib and send
» it to you if you trust me. I am almost ready to say that I can see a light
» 5 o’clock shadow on my right temple and my left temple is just starting to
» bud. I’m pretty sure I’m getting back some oldies on top and most likely
» some new ones from what I can tell on my hairline. They are so short that
» it does not make a cosmetic difference in terms of volume to my diffuse top
» yet. But… I could be seeing things and I’m not positive of this, but my
» see thru scalp does look darker than I rememeber it b4. Again, don’t hold
» me on this one yet. Yes, the horse shoe hairline looks like it might make
» it back to full recovery. The good thing about it is that the way it
» coming out, it blends right in with my existing hairline. Did I mention b4
» it is like an hiarchy effect if that is the correct way to discribe it.
» Hairs along the hairline are coming out faster than the new ones below it.
» The ones below it are “brand new” and yes I’m going for a straight across
» hair line. It is very weird. My temples are still red and inflamed btw.
» Oh, frankie b and myself no side effects whatsoever from this topically and
» I doubt you will also. What I can say is most of this is more than likely
» due to my first try on this without tacro ot anti-histimine. I used those
» 2 in conjunction the second time and I’m sure it has no visual impact yet
» because it is too early post 2nd experiment. If you are interested let me
» have your addy and I will work with you on this one. It looks loke most
» here will believe what you say. You need to use getfitnib. Again, I gain
» nothing from this.

Ok m8. But I’m uncomfortable posting my email addy up here publicly. Is there some private message thingy on here?
I appreciate your offer m8 and I’m willing to give it a go. I also believe that you are getting results. Let’s go for it!
By the way, what are you on the Norwood scale? You sound like you’re balder than most on here but maybe not as bald as myself.

[mikewalters]

» Ok m8. But I’m uncomfortable posting my email addy up here publicly. Is
» there some private message thingy on here?
» I appreciate your offer m8 and I’m willing to give it a go. I also believe
» that you are getting results. Let’s go for it!
» By the way, what are you on the Norwood scale? You sound like you’re
» balder than most on here but maybe not as bald as myself.

mikey66walters@gmail.com — email me your address and I will send u a bottle this week. I’m 37, NW 2.5 I would say with a diffusing top. I am not the worse case here. I would say I’m somewhere in the middle. I’ve been battling this for years and it’s been an up and down battle. I’ve tried RU, Minox, fin, T4, TB4, PS1, curcumin, my own homebrew, dut, natural route and the list keeps going. I’ve had my ups and down I tell you and mixing these things up is nothing new to me. I wouldn’t worry too much about topical immunos as I don’t think it did anything beneficial.

[cal]

I don’t care about being important, I just want this to work and get a good healthy noggin’ again, that is all. I still find it frustrating how I kind of got it to work somewhat topically and baccy got it to work topically (but I considered his results mostly rejuvenated hairs) yet most here are still looking to ingest these drugs. If no one else wants to do it topically (maybe a little differently in timing or such), then everyone will have to wait to see if things further improves. Let me tell you, that 1st experiment did do something to my wounded areas in the positive direction. I don’t have too much to say about it that I haven’t already said. Right now, it is the waiting game for me and the follicles – new and old.

As for internal, I really just remain focused on this method of action in terms of nailing down whether the entire Folica procedure is a viable idea or not. I just would rather risk a few rounds of internals than keep monkeying with topicals for months/years while never knowing whether the basics were even right.

Once somebody produces airtight evidence of what procedure basically works, I’ll be thrilled to switch to looking for less dangerous methods. I’m glad you guys are doing this topical stuff already. The more, the merrier. It’s hard to go wrong with more people trying things.

The internals are just what I personally want to do right now. I’m not trying to tell anyone else that it’s the safest or smartest way to go.

[mikewalters]

» I don’t care about being important, I just want this to work
» and get a good healthy noggin’ again, that is all. I still find it
» frustrating how I kind of got it to work somewhat topically and baccy got
» it to work topically (but I considered his results mostly rejuvenated
» hairs) yet most here are still looking to ingest these drugs. If no one
» else wants to do it topically (maybe a little differently in timing or
» such), then everyone will have to wait to see if things further improves.
» Let me tell you, that 1st experiment did do something to my wounded areas
» in the positive direction. I don’t have too much to say about it that I
» haven’t already said. Right now, it is the waiting game for me and the
» follicles – new and old.
»
» As for internal, I really just remain focused on this method of action in
» terms of nailing down whether the entire Folica procedure is a viable idea
» or not. I just would rather risk a few rounds of internals than keep
» monkeying with topicals for months/years while never knowing whether the
» basics were even right.
»
» Once somebody produces airtight evidence of what procedure basically
» works, I’ll be thrilled to switch to looking for less dangerous methods.
» I’m glad you guys are doing this topical stuff already. The more, the
» merrier. It’s hard to go wrong with more people trying things.
»
» The internals are just what I personally want to do right now. I’m not
» trying to tell anyone else that it’s the safest or smartest way to go.

understood