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Depression by finasteride and dutasteride


#1

If you people want to keep believing that fin and dut are harmless go ahead. But, let re-assure you. FINASTERIDE and and DUTASTESTERiDERiDE cause DEPRESSION!!! NoT I repeat NOT going bald itself, I wish that someone would publish this FACT! In the news. I am trying to help and have no hidden agendas. STOP believing the bullshit the few hairs you will grow are not worth the headache. BE COnFIDENT ANYWAY


#2

» If you people want to keep believing that fin and dut are harmless go
» ahead. But, let re-assure you. FINASTERIDE and and DUTASTESTERiDERiDE
» cause DEPRESSION!!! NoT I repeat NOT going bald itself, I wish that
» someone would publish this FACT! In the news. I am trying to help and have
» no hidden agendas. STOP believing the bullshit the few hairs you will grow
» are not worth the headache. BE COnFIDENT ANYWAY

You are absolutely right i was on Fin and definetely had depression among other things.Also i could not control my tember sometimes, my mind seemed to work slower.My face looked bloated and i had more bodyfat.

On the same time my hair looked awesome…the trade off though was 2 much 2 bare.(not to mention the libido problems :slight_smile: )


#3

» » If you people want to keep believing that fin and dut are harmless go
» » ahead. But, let re-assure you. FINASTERIDE and and DUTASTESTERiDERiDE
» » cause DEPRESSION!!! NoT I repeat NOT going bald itself, I wish that
» » someone would publish this FACT! In the news. I am trying to help and
» have
» » no hidden agendas. STOP believing the bullshit the few hairs you will
» grow
» » are not worth the headache. BE COnFIDENT ANYWAY
»
» You are absolutely right i was on Fin and definetely had depression among
» other things.Also i could not control my tember sometimes, my mind seemed
» to work slower.My face looked bloated and i had more bodyfat.
»
» On the same time my hair looked awesome…the trade off though was 2 much
» 2 bare.(not to mention the libido problems :slight_smile: )

These side effects are well known
thats why guys take NATURALS, that do the same thing with no side effects
ie natural 5 AR inhibitors


#4

Which of your “naturals” do you consider 5AR inhibitors? And do you know of any studies that can document this? I am very sincere in this question.


#5

» Which of your “naturals” do you consider 5AR inhibitors? And do you know
» of any studies that can document this? I am very sincere in this
» question.

Saw Palmetto,
Pygeum
Nettles
Beta Sitosterol

google them, Saw Palmetto is a weak 5 Ar inhibitor and you either respond to it or you dont, i was one of the lucky ones

guys tend to respond to this general class of supplements or they dont, if you are lucky you do, a lot of guys do

but in my opinion you need super hair vits and mins also


#6

YES. There are studies to prove that finasteride can lead to depression. Let me see if I can locate that from the archives.


#7

I’m already on beta sitosterol for my cholesterol (much higher dosage than you). Maybe I’m already getting an extra benefit. :slight_smile: I’ll check it out.


#8

» I’m already on beta sitosterol for my cholesterol (much higher dosage than
» you). Maybe I’m already getting an extra benefit. :slight_smile: I’ll check it
» out.

i had my benefits mainly from saw palmetto pygeum and nettles, the beta sis i think is not exactly the active ingredient in saw palmetto, though they say it is


#9

http://www.medsafe.govt.nz/Profs/Datash … ciatab.htm

Quote:
Animal Toxicology
Carcinogenicity
No evidence of a tumorigenic effect was observed in a 24-month study in rats receiving doses of finasteride up to 320 mg/kg/day (16,000 times the recommended human dose of 1 mg/day).

In a 19-month carcinogenicity study in mice, a statistically significant (p≤ 0.05) increase in the incidence of testicular Leydig cell adenoma was observed at a dose of 250 mg/kg/day (12,500 times the recommended human dose of 1 mg/day); no adenomas were seen in mice given 2.5 or 25 mg/kg/day (125 and 1,250 times the recommended human dose of 1 mg/day, respectively).

In mice at a dose of 25 mg/kg/day and in rats at a dose of ≥40 mg/kg/day (1,250 and ≥2,000 times the recommended human dose of 1 mg/day, respectively), an increase in the incidence of Leydig cell hyperplasia was observed.

A positive correlation between the proliferative changes of the Leydig cells and the increase in serum LH levels (2-3 fold above control) has been demonstrated in both rodent species treated with high doses of finasteride. This suggests the Leydig cell changes are secondary to elevated serum LH levels and not due to a direct effect of finasteride.

No medicine-related Leydig cell changes were seen in either rats or dogs treated with finasteride for one year at doses of 20 mg/kg/day and 45 mg/kg/day (1,000 and 2,250 times the recommended human dose of 1 mg/day, respectively) or in mice treated for 19 months at a dose of 2.5 mg/kg/day (125 times the recommended human dose of 1 mg/day).

…yeah, I’d say so.
The massive dosages given to the mice and rats should go to show alot of you just how thouroughly the FDA ordinarily tries to make sure a drug does no harm. We probably have lawsuits to thank for this.

This brings me back to something from the past however…We know that mice, rats, monkeys and men have two forms of alpha five reductase, and finasteride is tested on mice and rats to check for safety in high doses in humans based on it doing similar things to the rodents.
If that is so folks, then the fact that black tea drank by mice as their only beverage when they were thirsty in experiments reducing dht by 72% would lead me to conclude that it should do the same in humans.

http://jn.nutrition.org/cgi/content/full/133/2/516

Quote:
Mice treated with black tea tended to have a greater serum testosterone concentration (34.4%, P = 0.50) and had a 72% lower DHT concentration than controls (P < 0.05), suggesting that black tea may contain components that inhibit the activity of 5-reductase, an enzyme that converts testosterone to the more bioactive DHT.

Does anyone want to test this with a doctor? All you have to do is go get your serum DHT levels measured, drink black tea with your meals everyday for a couple of weeks and go back and get them remeasured, and then we can all know if it works internally or not…
I have a feeling that it would, and I also have a feeling based on the testosterone increases being what they were and the similar decrease in serum DHT than finasteride gives mice (hell, its greater), that it inhibits type two in humans being.
Just food for thought gents…


#10

» YES. There are studies to prove that finasteride can lead to depression.
» Let me see if I can locate that from the archives.

How about the dreaded “brain fog”?

Seriously, I started having memory and thinking problems about a year after beginning Avodart–it was like a brain fog, all right–my mind felt like it feels when you haven’t slept for 24 hours.

Which got much better after I started taking B12 supplements.

So it could have been the vegetarian diet (such diets can be low in B12) I switched to about the same time I began Avodart.

Even after “curing myself” by taking B12 supplements, my doctor gave me a blood test just to see how healthy I was, and noticed by B12 was borderline.

That’s when I told him about my earlier memory and thinking problems of the prior year.

So B12 deficiency was a pretty good guess on my part.

HOWEVER, I’ve always wondered if it was the Avodart and not the veg diet that is destroying B12 in my system.

If it happens that Avodart does reduce B12 in your blood, then that would explain the anecdotal reports of brain fog from avodart.


#11

» » YES. There are studies to prove that finasteride can lead to depression.
» » Let me see if I can locate that from the archives.
»
» How about the dreaded “brain fog”?
»
» Seriously, I started having memory and thinking problems about a year
» after beginning Avodart–it was like a brain fog, all right–my mind felt
» like it feels when you haven’t slept for 24 hours.
»
» Which got much better after I started taking B12 supplements.
»
» So it could have been the vegetarian diet (such diets can be low in B12) I
» switched to about the same time I began Avodart.
»
» Even after “curing myself” by taking B12 supplements, my doctor gave me a
» blood test just to see how healthy I was, and noticed by B12 was
» borderline.
»
» That’s when I told him about my earlier memory and thinking problems of
» the prior year.
»
» So B12 deficiency was a pretty good guess on my part.
»
» HOWEVER, I’ve always wondered if it was the Avodart and not the veg diet
» that is destroying B12 in my system.
»
» If it happens that Avodart does reduce B12 in your blood, then that would
» explain the anecdotal reports of brain fog from avodart.

you should be taking a super hair vitamin anyway, all of which have huge amounts of all the Bs
these are critical for healthy hair, and really make a huge difference as well as 2000mcg timed released biotin


#12

Avodart suppresses serum DHT by over 90%.

Finasteride suppressed serum DHT by roughly 70%, give or take as per individual.

Type 1 alpha five reductase, the kind finasteride has little/no effect on, is indeed found IN YOUR BRAIN. We do not know the sides of taking this drug for long periods of time because no person has been on avodart for twenty years yet. There could be something to “brain fog” and avodart usage as a few people have complained about it.

However, WE DO HAVE MANY MEN who have been on proscar (five mgs finasteride) for over two decades now. It seems pretty safe.


#13

» Avodart suppresses serum DHT by over 90%.
»
» Finasteride suppressed serum DHT by roughly 70%, give or take as per
» individual.
»
»
»
» Type 1 alpha five reductase, the kind finasteride has little/no effect on,
» is indeed found IN YOUR BRAIN. We do not know the sides of taking
» this drug for long periods of time because no person has been on avodart
» for twenty years yet. There could be something to “brain fog” and avodart
» usage as a few people have complained about it.
»
»
»
» However, WE DO HAVE MANY MEN who have been on proscar (five mgs
» finasteride) for over two decades now. It seems pretty safe.

I had been on Proscar and before that Propecia for a few years.

I have noticed a lot of physical changes since I began taking these and also more recently Avodart.

But the changes are more pronounced since Avodart.

It could be just that I’m getting old (nearly 60), or maybe it is the drugs-or both.


#14

The greek, for how long were you on finasteride? How long did it take for your libido to be back to normal after dropping Fin?


#15

» If you people want to keep believing that fin and dut are harmless go
» ahead. But, let re-assure you. FINASTERIDE and and DUTASTESTERiDERiDE
» cause DEPRESSION!!! NoT I repeat NOT going bald itself, I wish that
» someone would publish this FACT! In the news. I am trying to help and have
» no hidden agendas. STOP believing the bullshit the few hairs you will grow
» are not worth the headache. BE COnFIDENT ANYWAY

You are 100 percent correct. I had problematic depression and didn’t realize that finasteride was the culprit. I was on it for 7 years and struggeled from time to time. I have been off for 4 years with no problems and wish i had discovered the reason earlier.


#16

Joeboo, what about your hair then? Did you shed what fin had made you gain? What was your dosage of fin? 1mg? What did you replace fin with in your regimen?:confused: :confused:
Thx.


#17

» Does anyone want to test this with a doctor? All you have to do is go get
» your serum DHT levels measured, drink black tea with your meals everyday
» for a couple of weeks and go back and get them remeasured, and then we can
» all know if it works internally or not…

Great find.

Is regular tea called black tea or is this some other kind of tea?

I shall start drinking it. Hopefully it does not taste like crap.


#18

» It could be just that I’m getting old (nearly 60), or maybe it is the
» drugs-or both.

At your age, it could be senility or alzheimer’s disease creeping up on you.

There is no evidence that DHT has any role to play with memory or alertness. It is however a steroid so I’d be more inclined to believe any story associated with muscle mass or motor control.


#19

» » It could be just that I’m getting old (nearly 60), or maybe it is the
» » drugs-or both.
»
» At your age, it could be senility or alzheimer’s disease creeping up on
» you.
»
» There is no evidence that DHT has any role to play with memory or
» alertness. It is however a steroid so I’d be more inclined to believe any
» story associated with muscle mass or motor control.

Except for one thing.

It seems to vary with the dosage of Avodart and B vitamins.

If I vary either (e.g., take Avodart every other day vs. every day or stop taking B vitamins), my mind sharpens or weakens in proportion.

When Avodart first came out, several posters here complained of “brain fog” (I didn’t originate the term), and were pooh-poohed by others here.

I should also say that I am not getting enough sleep, either.

Perhaps Avodart affects sleep patterns?