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Artificial liver grown on lab


#1

Scientists have grown an artificial liver on a lab.
It is a limited liver but can break toxins.

I think that a liver is a much more complex organ than hair. So why the hell can’t they grow hair’???

telegraph.co.uk article


#2

» Scientists have grown an artificial liver on a lab.
» It is a limited liver but can break toxins.

I’m pretty sure that this article would cost Dr. Anthony Atala (Aderans Advisory Board Member) just a weary smile …

» I think that a liver is a much more complex organ than hair. So why the
» hell can’t they grow hair’???

The reason the hair follicle is so complex (and fascinating as well) is it’s cycling!

A hair grows, falls out, and another grows in its place. It’s the body’s only organ in which there’s a total loss of cells and then a total regrowth of those cells. And this cycling goes on throughout your lifetime. The cells that make a hair are some of the most rapidly proliferating in the body, and quite suddenly, they shut down and die. The follicle’s stem cells are very quiescent, and quite suddenly, they awaken and set regrowth in motion. And there is the BIG question among lots of researchers: How do cells know when to do these things?

Anyway, as you can see, you CAN’T compare a liver with hair follicles!

BTW – Hair follicles are even more complex than the biggest organ of the human body – the skin.


#3

» » Scientists have grown an artificial liver on a lab.
» » It is a limited liver but can break toxins.
»
» I’m pretty sure that this article would cost Dr. Anthony Atala (Aderans
» Advisory Board Member) just a weary smile …
»
» http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=5975132n
»
» » I think that a liver is a much more complex organ than hair. So why the
» » hell can’t they grow hair’???
»
» The reason the hair follicle is so complex (and fascinating as well) is
» it’s cycling!
»
» A hair grows, falls out, and another grows in its place. It’s the body’s
» only organ in which there’s a total loss of cells and then a total regrowth
» of those cells. And this cycling goes on throughout your lifetime. The
» cells that make a hair are some of the most rapidly proliferating in the
» body, and quite suddenly, they shut down and die. The follicle’s stem cells
» are very quiescent, and quite suddenly, they awaken and set regrowth in
» motion. And there is the BIG question among lots of researchers: How do
» cells know when to do these things?
»
» Anyway, as you can see, you CAN’T compare a liver with hair follicles!
»
» BTW – Hair follicles are even more complex than the biggest organ of the
» human body – the skin.

Its something i’ve wondered about also ever since the two trachea transplants that were carried out. stripping the donor cells away with enzymes and replacing it with the recipients cells tricked the body into thinking that the organs were indeed native and thus eliminating the need for anti-rejection drugs. Its something i would love to see tested. Take donor hair follicles from a cadaver and treat them with the recipients own stemm cells to see if the body would reject it and also even if the hair would grow at all. On a side note to that there has been some progress in the study of anti rejection drugs where researchers are trying to develop ways of again tricking the bodys immune system and thus again eliminating all the add on side effects that these drugs cause. If a successful method is found then this could also be applied to hair transplants as there would then be a limitless supply from which to use.


#4

» » Scientists have grown an artificial liver on a lab.
» » It is a limited liver but can break toxins.
»
» I’m pretty sure that this article would cost Dr. Anthony Atala (Aderans
» Advisory Board Member) just a weary smile …
»
» http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=5975132n
»
» » I think that a liver is a much more complex organ than hair. So why the
» » hell can’t they grow hair’???
»
» The reason the hair follicle is so complex (and fascinating as well) is
» it’s cycling!
»
» A hair grows, falls out, and another grows in its place. It’s the body’s
» only organ in which there’s a total loss of cells and then a total regrowth
» of those cells. And this cycling goes on throughout your lifetime. The
» cells that make a hair are some of the most rapidly proliferating in the
» body, and quite suddenly, they shut down and die. The follicle’s stem cells
» are very quiescent, and quite suddenly, they awaken and set regrowth in
» motion. And there is the BIG question among lots of researchers: How do
» cells know when to do these things?
»
» Anyway, as you can see, you CAN’T compare a liver with hair follicles!
»
» BTW – Hair follicles are even more complex than the biggest organ of the
» human body – the skin.

That makes no sense to me. The fact that the hair follicle sheds and is cyclical in nature has nothing to do with building the actual physiological structure. It’s not as if they are intending to create cells which are pre-programmed to shed a hair shaft at a designated time. You create a liver, and it performs it’s function. Similarly, you create a follicle and it does its job. Do you have any evidence to back this claim up?


#5

The article just says “Artificial liver grown in lab”.

It does not say “Artificial livers are now commercially viable and will be replacing patient-to-patient liver transplants from now on.”


#6

» The article just says “Artificial liver grown in lab”.
»
» It does not say “Artificial livers are now commercially viable and will be
» replacing patient-to-patient liver transplants from now on.”

Actually they say the standard think of within 5 years. I think scientists repeat this as a mantra or something.


#7

» The article just says “Artificial liver grown in lab”.
»
» It does not say “Artificial livers are now commercially viable and will be
» replacing patient-to-patient liver transplants from now on.”

I don’t even understand what your argument has to do with what I stated.


#8

My point was just about the whole thread. Doing something once in a lab is very different from actually replacing the standard method of treating a condition.

New hair follicles were first created in a lab decades ago.

You can even dermabrade your skin and you may get a few new follicles to form.


#9

I think you are right on this.
I have also come up with the conclusion that hair is not as simple as we often imply.
Indeed, its not a matter of growing a follicle, but this follicle must cycle every few years.

We don’t know if this “cycling mechanism” is easy to reproduce or not. But if it is difficult enough, we will see livers, hearts, kidneys, and other organs out in the market before HM.

» » Scientists have grown an artificial liver on a lab.
» » It is a limited liver but can break toxins.
»
» I’m pretty sure that this article would cost Dr. Anthony Atala (Aderans
» Advisory Board Member) just a weary smile …
»
» http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=5975132n
»
» » I think that a liver is a much more complex organ than hair. So why the
» » hell can’t they grow hair’???
»
» The reason the hair follicle is so complex (and fascinating as well) is
» it’s cycling!
»
» A hair grows, falls out, and another grows in its place. It’s the body’s
» only organ in which there’s a total loss of cells and then a total regrowth
» of those cells. And this cycling goes on throughout your lifetime. The
» cells that make a hair are some of the most rapidly proliferating in the
» body, and quite suddenly, they shut down and die. The follicle’s stem cells
» are very quiescent, and quite suddenly, they awaken and set regrowth in
» motion. And there is the BIG question among lots of researchers: How do
» cells know when to do these things?
»
» Anyway, as you can see, you CAN’T compare a liver with hair follicles!
»
» BTW – Hair follicles are even more complex than the biggest organ of the
» human body – the skin.


#10

» I think you are right on this.
» I have also come up with the conclusion that hair is not as simple as we
» often imply.
» Indeed, its not a matter of growing a follicle, but this follicle must
» cycle every few years.
»
» We don’t know if this “cycling mechanism” is easy to reproduce or not. But
» if it is difficult enough, we will see livers, hearts, kidneys, and other
» organs out in the market before HM.
»
» » » Scientists have grown an artificial liver on a lab.
» » » It is a limited liver but can break toxins.
» »
» » I’m pretty sure that this article would cost Dr. Anthony Atala (Aderans
» » Advisory Board Member) just a weary smile …
» »
» » http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=5975132n
» »
» » » I think that a liver is a much more complex organ than hair. So why
» the
» » » hell can’t they grow hair’???
» »
» » The reason the hair follicle is so complex (and fascinating as well) is
» » it’s cycling!
» »
» » A hair grows, falls out, and another grows in its place. It’s the
» body’s
» » only organ in which there’s a total loss of cells and then a total
» regrowth
» » of those cells. And this cycling goes on throughout your lifetime. The
» » cells that make a hair are some of the most rapidly proliferating in
» the
» » body, and quite suddenly, they shut down and die. The follicle’s stem
» cells
» » are very quiescent, and quite suddenly, they awaken and set regrowth in
» » motion. And there is the BIG question among lots of researchers: How do
» » cells know when to do these things?
» »
» » Anyway, as you can see, you CAN’T compare a liver with hair follicles!
» »
» » BTW – Hair follicles are even more complex than the biggest organ of
» the
» » human body – the skin.

i think you are both wrong. i don’t believe cycling is more “different” than heart beating. every stem cell (or whatever those cells are) knows exactly what is his correct function. they are programmed to do their own tasks for example heart is pumping, hair is cycling etc.


#11

Cycling or not cycling the hair, if they can make a liver from stem cells why the F#@! can’t they also do a hair from stem cells (whether is cycles or not)???
Once they do hairs from stem cells they can see whether it cycles or not but first they have to do it and it sure looks simpler a hair than a liver with its highly complex functionality.

Are they trying? That is the question.
Damn!!!


#12

» Cycling or not cycling the hair, if they can make a liver from stem cells
» why the F#@! can’t they also do a hair from stem cells (whether is cycles
» or not)???
» Once they do hairs from stem cells they can see whether it cycles or not
» but first they have to do it and it sure looks simpler a hair than a liver
» with its highly complex functionality.
»
» Are they trying? That is the question.
» Damn!!!

i understood they can make growing hair already but we don’t know what is the yield and how safe hm is for human beings. i think most of cells what they inject back to scalp doesn’t induce hair and this is the problem at the moment. they need to figure out how to get superior results + it must be safe (no tumors etc).


#13

» » Cycling or not cycling the hair, if they can make a liver from stem
» cells
» » why the F#@! can’t they also do a hair from stem cells (whether is
» cycles
» » or not)???
» » Once they do hairs from stem cells they can see whether it cycles or
» not
» » but first they have to do it and it sure looks simpler a hair than a
» liver
» » with its highly complex functionality.
» »
» » Are they trying? That is the question.
» » Damn!!!
»
» i understood they can make growing hair already but we don’t know what is
» the yield and how safe hm is for human beings. i think most of cells what
» they inject back to scalp doesn’t induce hair and this is the problem at
» the moment. they need to figure out how to get superior results + it must
» be safe (no tumors etc).

Its not a ase of just growing a liver from scratch they use a donor liver and strip it of its stem cells so it basically becomes a scaffold and then coat it with the recipient stem cells. And yes i would like to see something similar done with a hair follicles. take a hundred donor follicles from a donor and treat them accordingly and implant them to a bald scalp and study the results.


#14

I think all the researchers can grow hairs, but they won’t cycle.
So, they are useless, and this is not commercially offered.

» Cycling or not cycling the hair, if they can make a liver from stem cells
» why the F#@! can’t they also do a hair from stem cells (whether is cycles
» or not)???
» Once they do hairs from stem cells they can see whether it cycles or not
» but first they have to do it and it sure looks simpler a hair than a liver
» with its highly complex functionality.
»
» Are they trying? That is the question.
» Damn!!!


#15

» i understood they can make growing hair already but we don’t know what is
» the yield and how safe hm is for human beings. i think most of cells what
» they inject back to scalp doesn’t induce hair and this is the problem at
» the moment. they need to figure out how to get superior results + it must
» be safe (no tumors etc).

The following is the response by Dr. Ken Washenik in 2003:

#17 HairSite: What are some of the obstacles or stumbling blocks that need to be resolved?

Dr. Washenik: The very basic and yet most critical is the issue of safety, for example,

  • will the procedure induce the growth of something other than hair in patients?

  • Also, among some of the other issues that need to be resolved are hair quality, hair direction, and hair cycle.

  • Equally important is whether the new procedure will induce follicular groupings or not. If they are just generating single hairs, we might have to do this technique in conjunction with conventional follicle based hair transplantation to achieve cosmetically acceptable results.


So TODAY, the BIG question is: Could they solve ALL obstacles in the meanwhile ?

In addidion …

#18 HairSite: According to some studies, one problem cited with hair follicle or dermal papilla culturing is that the cells may lose their phenotype with multiple passages, thus limiting how many cells you can culture from one and still get follicular differentiation. Is this true? Has this issued been solved?

Dr. Washenik: Yes. This is still very much a challenge for researchers nowadays [2003] and is currently one of the areas of investigation by ARI.


#16

» I think all the researchers can grow hairs, but they won’t cycle.
» So, they are useless, and this is not commercially offered.

how they test the cycling? hair are in anagen phase usually 4-6 years. it means that their phase 2 human studies last least 4+ years? and then there will come phase 3 and this needs again 4+ years to fully complete those studies. if it’s so then it’s bad (really long time).


#17

» » i understood they can make growing hair already but we don’t know what
» is
» » the yield and how safe hm is for human beings. i think most of cells
» what
» » they inject back to scalp doesn’t induce hair and this is the problem
» at
» » the moment. they need to figure out how to get superior results + it
» must
» » be safe (no tumors etc).
»
» The following is the response by Dr. Ken Washenik in 2003:
» -------------------
» #17 HairSite: What are some of the obstacles or stumbling
» blocks that need to be resolved?

»
» Dr. Washenik: The very basic and yet most critical is the issue of
» safety, for example,
»
» - will the procedure induce the growth of something other than hair in
» patients?
»
» - Also, among some of the other issues that need to be resolved are hair
» quality, hair direction, and hair
» cycle
.
»
» - Equally important is whether the new procedure will induce
» follicular groupings or not. If they are just
» generating single hairs, we might have to do this technique in conjunction
» with conventional follicle based hair transplantation to achieve
» cosmetically acceptable results.
» -------------------
»
» So TODAY, the BIG question is: Could they solve ALL obstacles in the
» meanwhile ?
»
» In addidion …
» -------------------
» #18 HairSite: According to some studies, one problem cited
» with hair follicle or dermal papilla culturing is that the cells may lose
» their phenotype with multiple passages, thus limiting how many cells you
» can culture from one and still get follicular differentiation. Is this
» true? Has this issued been solved?

»
» Dr. Washenik: Yes. This is still very much a challenge for researchers
» nowadays [2003] and is currently one of the areas of investigation by ARI.
» -------------------

is it possible that Hairsite or i dunno who else can make an interview with the aderan’s guys to ask how far they are now with their studies and what is the biggest barriers at the moment??? maybe they can give us an answer what kind of progress they have made since 2003


#18

» » I think all the researchers can grow hairs, but they won’t cycle.
» » So, they are useless, and this is not commercially offered.
»
»
» how they test the cycling? hair are in anagen phase usually 4-6 years. it
» means that their phase 2 human studies last least 4+ years? and then there
» will come phase 3 and this needs again 4+ years to fully complete those
» studies. if it’s so then it’s bad (really long time).

what?

what are you talking about?

who said that?

did aderans say such a thing? did icx ?


#19

» I think all the researchers can grow hairs, but they won’t cycle.
» So, they are useless, and this is not commercially offered.

For years and years, I’ve been saying here that I suspect each hair follicle is genetically programmed to cycle only a fixed number in a person’s lifetime.

AND that I suspect efforts to clone hair may result in a reduction of cycles in each resulting follicle.

So for example, if you make two follicles out of one, you’ll get half the number of cycles in each of the resulting follicles.

Make four follicles from one, and you’ll get one-fourth the number of cycles in each new follicle.

And so forth.

Now, I am not as sure about that as I am about the idea of a fixed number of cycles in the original follicles–an idea that explains much of what I have observed.

For example, why is the hair on my head that was most often put into shock fallout during my plug transplants decades ago, since become now thinner and weaker than the hair on my head that was not shocked so much during those procedures, in many cases not as thin as the hair remaining in the donor area, which wasn’t as much affected by shock fallout?

My idea also is that once follicles start their decine in MPB, they do so by speeding up the cycles, so that each time a follicle begins to grow hair after resting, the hair grows for a shorter and shorter time with each cycle, until it uses up it’s fixed number of cycles and grows no more or reverts to vellus growth.

Once those cycles are used up, then it’s no wonder it’s too late for Avodat or Finasteride to help.

Also eplains so-called ‘scarring alopecia’ when someone obsessivly pulls out their own hair overr and over again until it no longer grows back.

Or pulls thei hair tightly into braids or ponytail, the stress pulls out the hairs, increasing the number of cycles in a give time period, thereby using up those cycles until the follicle grows no more hair.


#20

» how they test the cycling? hair are in anagen phase usually 4-6 years. it
» means that their phase 2 human studies last least 4+ years? and then there
» will come phase 3 and this needs again 4+ years to fully complete those
» studies.

They might pull out the hairs or induce shock fall out, then wait 4 months or so to see if the follicles regrow.

Then pull out the hairs again, and repeat.

Strictly speaking, this is not 100% scientific proof, but if the hairs continued to regrow, there would be a reasonable chance they would cycle normally.