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ARI: just 10 injections per cm2?


#1

According to Shooter, ARI is just placing 10 injections per cm2.
We haven’t discussed about this. This is important.

What is the meaning of each injection? Is each injection suppossed to create a single new hair, or more?

I think ICX placed 100 injections in a 1 cm2 test area (confirmation needed), and Paul Kemp claimed to have got 66 new hairs (probably they didn’t cycle, and fell off).

This low density of injections could explain ARI’s soso results, maybe? Then why Minoxidil, instead of more injections? Minoxidil is a pain in the ass to apply everyday twice a day.


#2

10 per cm2 is a more realistic protocol for a mass-marketed commercial product.

100/per sounds pretty far out there. Get a piece of paper and try drawing 100 dots on a single cm2.


#3

» According to Shooter, ARI is just placing 10 injections per cm2.
» We haven’t discussed about this. This is important.
»
» What is the meaning of each injection? Is each injection suppossed to
» create a single new hair, or more?
»
» I think ICX placed 100 injections in a 1 cm2 test area (confirmation
» needed), and Paul Kemp claimed to have got 66 new hairs (probably they
» didn’t cycle, and fell off).
»
» This low density of injections could explain ARI’s soso results, maybe?
» Then why Minoxidil, instead of more injections? Minoxidil is a pain in the
» ass to apply everyday twice a day.
where are they with phase 2? almost done?
Thanks Jeff


#4

They might have been almost done if ARI hadn’t extended its phase#2 trials partway through. It’s not a terrible sign but it’s probably not a good one either.

We’ve probably got another year before the phase#2 results.


#5

Cal, after watching the posted photos, and from BHT posts, I am under the impression that they are precisely growing about 10 hairs per cm2. Maybe its 1 hair per injection after all. If this is true, the results would be good.

This is just another theory, in this case a positive one. But if this was true, again, why they resorted to Minox?

» 10 per cm2 is a more realistic protocol for a mass-marketed commercial
» product.
»
»
» 100/per sounds pretty far out there. Get a piece of paper and try drawing
» 100 dots on a single cm2.


#6

» Cal, after watching the posted photos, and from BHT posts, I am under the
» impression that they are precisely growing about 10 hairs per cm2. Maybe
» its 1 hair per injection after all. If this is true, the results would be
» good.
»
» This is just another theory, in this case a positive one. But if this was
» true, again, why they resorted to Minox?
»
» » 10 per cm2 is a more realistic protocol for a mass-marketed commercial
» » product.
» »
» »
» » 100/per sounds pretty far out there. Get a piece of paper and try
» drawing

I could be wrong but did intercytex have some sort of automated delivery device in production?


#7

» » Cal, after watching the posted photos, and from BHT posts, I am under
» the
» » impression that they are precisely growing about 10 hairs per cm2.
» Maybe
» » its 1 hair per injection after all. If this is true, the results would
» be
» » good.
» »
» » This is just another theory, in this case a positive one. But if this
» was
» » true, again, why they resorted to Minox?
» »
» » » 10 per cm2 is a more realistic protocol for a mass-marketed
» commercial
» » » product.
» » »
» » »
» » » 100/per sounds pretty far out there. Get a piece of paper and try
» » drawing
» --------------
» I could be wrong but did intercytex have some sort of automated delivery
» device in production?

http://www.intercytex.com/icx/news/releases/2006/2006-10-06/


#8

» 10 per cm2 is a more realistic protocol for a mass-marketed commercial
» product.
»
»
» 100/per sounds pretty far out there. Get a piece of paper and try drawing
» 100 dots on a single cm2.

… no problem: :smiley:

Or a version for the printer (ratio 1 : 1) for “a better estimation”:
img/uploaded_files/2879_file26.pdf

Anyway, here is how Intercytex actually did it (injections) …

Aderans and Intercytex ISHRS 2007:
http://www.regrowhair.com/non-surgical-hair-loss-treatments/propecia-finasteride/ishrs-meeting-vegas/

Dr. Bessam Farjo, The Times, 2008, about the Intercytex approach:

Dr. Bessam Farjo, ISHRS 2009, about the Intercytex approach/results:

“Hair Cloning” status review – update from the ISHRS 17th Annual Scientific Meeting (July, 2009)
Dr. Bassam Farjo, the principal investigator for Intercytex Phase II Cell Therapy Research Trial in UK, gave an update on the current status of follicular stem-cell therapy, commonly referred as “hair cloning” by the general population.There are two major organizations, Intercytex and Aderans, working on cell therapies, each using a slightly different approach. Intercytex just completed its Phase II trial but couldn’t successfully grow human hair follicles. Hence there is no plans to move onto Phase III at this time. Aderans is still in the midst of its Phase II trial. When asked a time frame one can expect these treatments to become commercially available, Dr. Farjo said “a long time.”
Source: http://www.kchairrestoration.com/uhr1/blog.asp

And finally Intercytex’s PhaseII RESULTS 2009:


Hopefully Aderans is more successful … :hungry:


#9

intercytex was a total fail so all we hope aderans will have more success


#10

»
» Dr. Bessam Farjo, The Times, 2008, about the Intercytex approach:
» http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/men/article4045906.ece
»
» Dr. Bessam Farjo, ISHRS 2009, about the Intercytex approach/results:
» -----------------------------
» “Hair Cloning” status review – update from the ISHRS 17th
» Annual Scientific Meeting (July, 2009)
» Dr. Bassam Farjo, the principal investigator for Intercytex Phase II Cell
» Therapy Research Trial in UK, gave an update on the current status of
» follicular stem-cell therapy, commonly referred as “hair cloning” by the
» general population.There are two major organizations, Intercytex and
» Aderans, working on cell therapies, each using a slightly different
» approach. Intercytex just completed its Phase II trial but couldn’t
» successfully grow human hair follicles
. Hence there is no plans to move
» onto Phase III at this time. Aderans is still in the midst of its Phase II
» trial. When asked a time frame one can expect these treatments to become
» commercially available, Dr. Farjo said “a long time.”
» Source: http://www.kchairrestoration.com/uhr1/blog.asp
» -----------------------------
»
» And finally Intercytex’s PhaseII RESULTS 2009:
» http://www.baldingblog.com/2009/04/10/images-for-intercytex-announces-icx-trc-phase-2-results/
» http://www.baldingblog.com/2009/04/03/intercytex-announces-icx-trc-phase-2-results/
»
» Hopefully Aderans is more successful … :hungry:

oh sh.it

he did admit it .

Phase II trial but couldn’t
» successfully grow human hair follicles

Rationally thinking, Aderans will faill too. Actually this is exactly what the guy said.

  Dr. Farjo said “a long time.

good.

does anybody remember a PDF released by icx some years ago, showing a hairpiece like thing, placed on a knee or something?It looked like a knee at least. It was their phase 2 proof.

bad news from you this time iron man.:cool:


#11

» »
»
»
» oh sh.it
»
» he did admit it .
»
» Phase II trial but couldn’t
» » successfully grow human hair follicles
»
» Rationally thinking, Aderans will faill too. Actually this is exactly what
» the guy said.
»
» Dr. Farjo said “a long time.
»
» good.
»
» does anybody remember a PDF released by icx some years ago, showing a
» hairpiece like thing, placed on a knee or something?It looked like a knee
» at least. It was their phase 2 proof.
»
» bad news from you this time iron man.:cool:

I wouldnt say rationally thinkin that it will fail. While Aderans may have similarities to intercytex this does not mean that they are identical. I’m not saying that Aderans is the answer or if it will result in anything at all but it is a bit premature to suggest that one will fail because the other did. Aderans may have found a different approach that is necessary for follicle formulation. Another thing is i’d be surprised if they were to follow the exact course of action that intercytex took knowing that they failed. I think even the investors would see that one coming.


#12

ICX did human trials on something like 6 people.

The Aderans operation is huge. Hundreds of trialists in multiple different locations. It isn’t even in the same ballpark.


#13

» ICX did human trials on something like 6 people.
»
» The Aderans operation is huge. Hundreds of trialists in multiple
» different locations. It isn’t even in the same ballpark.

Exactly ICX had some good things in their research which have been sold to Ari including the bad outcomes to not do this mistake a second time.

And btw compare 6 to 7 test subjects to over 200 :slight_smile:

Even if you would have a group of 200 people living on earth and 6 out of this would be ICX, they would have that impact on the statistics


#14

yeah, ARI’s trials are huge, while ICX’s were ridiculous.
Thats something to be optimistic about, BUT, a little theory:

Why ARI’s trials are so big (and expensive)? Is this because they are confident that they will succeed?
It is possible that ARI themselves are not so sure about the success, but maybe the japanese guys from Aderans made an ultimatum: “now or never: show what you are able to do. We are going to provide you with enough funds to do a decent trial, but if you fail, its over.”. That would explain why the trial is a BIG, TRUE trial. They are trying hatd to make it work, but having lots of difficulties.

In contrast, I am pretty sure that ICX knew that TRC would fail, and they never tried hard to make it work. That is why they allocated very few resources to TRC.

» » ICX did human trials on something like 6 people.
» »
» » The Aderans operation is huge. Hundreds of trialists in multiple
» » different locations. It isn’t even in the same ballpark.
»
» Exactly ICX had some good things in their research which have been sold to
» Ari including the bad outcomes to not do this mistake a second time.
»
» And btw compare 6 to 7 test subjects to over 200 :slight_smile:
»
» Even if you would have a group of 200 people living on earth and 6 out of
» this would be ICX, they would have that impact on the statistics


#15

These are your assumptions nothing more, even i could assume its the other way round so what.

BTW i didnt post my email repsone because you are exactly like this

  1. If ARI uses 10 njectons you cry “Its not enough they are not aiming for a full head of hair------THEY FAIL”

  2. If Ari uses 100 injections you would cry " They have to use 100 injections ------this wont work------THEY Fail"

So to make long things short, you are boring, boring s sh*t and its every time.

Your only words are

I think, maybe, i believe, iam sure (but have no informations) so its just assumptions

You know what WRITE THEM EMAILS, CALL THEM, Your english works in this forum, even myself as a german can speak english.

WHat did they teach you in school down in SPain? Paella making for dummies or Bull Fight for dummies?

» yeah, ARI’s trials are huge, while ICX’s were ridiculous.
» Thats something to be optimistic about, BUT, a little theory:
»
» Why ARI’s trials are so big (and expensive)? Is this because they are
» confident that they will succeed?
» It is possible that ARI themselves are not so sure about the success, but
» maybe the japanese guys from Aderans made an ultimatum: “now or never: show
» what you are able to do. We are going to provide you with enough funds to
» do a decent trial, but if you fail, its over.”. That would explain why the
» trial is a BIG, TRUE trial. They are trying hatd to make it work, but
» having lots of difficulties.
»
» In contrast, I am pretty sure that ICX knew that TRC would fail, and they
» never tried hard to make it work. That is why they allocated very few
» resources to TRC.


#16

» Then why Minoxidil, instead of more injections? Minoxidil is a pain in the
» ass to apply everyday twice a day.

Where does this information come from that they request trialists to use Minoxidil? I was under the impression that when they recruited trialists they specifically excluded anyone from participating in the trials if they were using Minoxidil.


#17

» » Then why Minoxidil, instead of more injections? Minoxidil is a pain in
» the
» » ass to apply everyday twice a day.
»
» Where does this information come from that they request trialists to use
» Minoxidil? I was under the impression that when they recruited trialists
» they specifically excluded anyone from participating in the trials
» if they were using Minoxidil.

It is confirmed. “Shooter” and “ZZ” contacted 2 trial centers pretending to be interested on enrolling as trialists. They were told that they would have to use Minoxidil, before the biopsy, and later, during the trial, all over their heads.
Also, BHT, who started the trial without Minoxidil, was put on Minoxidil “on the fly”.

I.e., they enroll people excluding those who were using Minoxidil, but later they apply Minoxidil to them, and thus, they are oviously distorting the results.


#18

» BTW i didnt post my email repsone because you are exactly like this
»
» 1) If ARI uses 10 njectons you cry “Its not enough they are not aiming for
» a full head of hair------THEY FAIL”
»
» 2) If Ari uses 100 injections you would cry " They have to use 100
» injections ------this wont work------THEY Fail"

You are not posting the email, because you are lying, you don’t have any email, or the email is laughable.
And you are wrong. I am not complaining that they are injecting 10 injections per cm2. In fact I was trying to justify the lack of results.

» WHat did they teach you in school down in SPain? Paella making for dummies
» or Bull Fight for dummies?

Your continued racist comments are funny, considering that you are a jew and you blame others for being “antisemitics”, “supremacists”, etc.


#19

» And you are wrong. I am not complaining that they are injecting 10
» injections per cm2. In fact I was trying to justify the lack of results.

Eh? What?
I thought you’re VERY “positiv” and so VERY “satisfied” with the results?


posted by Spanish Dude, 22.06.2010, 19:10

Title: i am very positive

I am very satisfied with this new info.
[…]
Overall, it is ovious that they are trying very hard. I am very satisfied.

Source: http://www.hairsite.com/hair-loss/forum_entry-id-69417-page-0-category-0-order-last_answer.html

And NOW you’re trying “to justify the lack of results” ???

I think you should contact my special friend and psychocian Dr. Ray Woods. Because he knows what good stuff the Dutch people smoke - and where to get it … :smiley:


#20

Thats what i was always telling you guys. Spanish Dude is insane, this is meant serious and not to flame him.

BTW Iron Man i need your Answers in the Whitfield thread

» » And you are wrong. I am not complaining that they are injecting 10
» » injections per cm2. In fact I was trying to justify the lack of
» results
.
»
» Eh? What?
» I thought you’re VERY “positiv” and so VERY “satisfied” with the results?
»
» --------------------
» posted by Spanish Dude, 22.06.2010, 19:10
»
» Title: i am very positive
»
» I am very satisfied with this new info.
» […]
» Overall, it is ovious that they are trying very hard. I am very
» satisfied.
»
» Source:
» http://www.hairsite.com/hair-loss/forum_entry-id-69417-page-0-category-0-order-last_answer.html
»
» --------------------
»
» And NOW you’re trying “to justify the lack of results” ???
»
» I think you should contact my special friend and psychocian Dr. Ray Woods.
» Because he knows what good stuff the Dutch people smoke - and where to get
» it … :smiley: